FanGraphs Baseball

Comments

RSS feed for comments on this post.

  1. Hey, now, a win in that June 6th game also advances the Rangers to the real playoffs. Obviously, this one is more emotionally devastating, but the June 6th one was equally as devastating to their chances of winning a World Series.

    Comment by Eric — October 4, 2012 @ 2:27 pm

  2. Mistakes will happen. What irks me is he appeared to be loafing. On such a fly ball the A way to field it is to get there soon enough to be waiting for it, not still moving towards it as it comes down. A bad result, but a lazy effort.

    Comment by Tanned Tom — October 4, 2012 @ 2:29 pm

  3. agreed.

    on mlb.tv they mentioned that wash asked him if he lost it in the sun and he said no. so an uber-talented MLB level CF just dropped a routine fly ball. that just doesn’t happen. hate to say it but he and the rest of the rangers team just didn’t seem to care. they looked out of it before the game even started.

    Comment by Bob — October 4, 2012 @ 2:35 pm

  4. Is that how they started with a 5-1 lead?

    Comment by marlins12 — October 4, 2012 @ 2:45 pm

  5. Even after the error was made, he seemed to be very leisure and care little about the situation by jogging to the dropped ball slowly. If he tried harder Cespedes may had to stop at first. His effort was definitely in doubt.

    Comment by Kampfer — October 4, 2012 @ 2:58 pm

  6. Never discount the ‘sky’ in the Bay Area in September and October.

    Comment by channelclemente — October 4, 2012 @ 2:59 pm

  7. A 5-1 lead on a bunch of BS squibs. Wash said it best they were out played all series period. they could have won either of the first two. JH will for sure be a little poorer leaving that as his I’m a FA moment.

    Comment by Tim A — October 4, 2012 @ 3:01 pm

  8. “Those people would make for bad friends and worse significant others, because those people are complete idiots.”

    Laughed out at my computer at work. Thanks, Jeff. If I lose my job for loafing like Hamilton did on that fly ball, I’m blaming you.

    Comment by Adam M — October 4, 2012 @ 3:25 pm

  9. Just as we can’t say how subsequent innings would have played out had Hamilton made that catch in game 162, we can’t say how subsequent games would have played out had the Rangers won on June 6th. I’d say yesterday’s gaffe has a more significant negative WSPA (World Series Proabablity Added) than does anything that happened back in June.

    Comment by NatsFan73 — October 4, 2012 @ 3:29 pm

  10. brooks conrad malkoviched josh hamilton

    Comment by joe bananas — October 4, 2012 @ 3:34 pm

  11. he was bad, but you would think he attacked an opposing player or shot a teammate the way people are jumping on this guy. he has a chance to make up for it Friday and the rest of the post-season if they win. I thought he loafed on the play but he may do that 100 times and only miss once. What about the time he cadillac’d a pop-fly and caught it? Nobody talks about those times….

    Comment by Aggie E — October 4, 2012 @ 3:35 pm

  12. You mean like how Matt Holliday only got 7/120 after making a huge outfield error versus the Dodgers IN the playoffs.

    Comment by Danmay — October 4, 2012 @ 3:36 pm

  13. This is the worst but not the only time Hamilton has just disappeared. Used to be he would disappear to the disabled list. This year his plate discipline disappears and his production goes with it. Some of the excuses for these slumps are so ridiculous I couldn’t have made them up.

    Obviously when he’s on his game he produces. All he has to do is lay off the pitches out of the zone away, and suddenly he’s one of the best pure hitters you’ve ever seen. A monster.

    So many issues, though. Distractions. I’ll be happy to see him walk. The Rangers can offset his loss by finding a merely above average outfielder and dropping MIke Young for a league average hitter. To the team who signs him as a free agent, I say good luck. He is not going to age well and will become a mistake hitter pretty soon.

    Comment by TrappedInAfangraph — October 4, 2012 @ 3:44 pm

  14. Well the frustration directed toward Hamilton isn’t just about yesterday’s game.

    Comment by TrappedInAfangraph — October 4, 2012 @ 3:46 pm

  15. He already is a mistake hitter..

    Comment by Aggie E — October 4, 2012 @ 3:50 pm

  16. Agreed. I kinda feel like if the Rangers lose the coin-flip game, this incident will hasten Hamilton’s departure from Arlington.

    Comment by ralph — October 4, 2012 @ 3:52 pm

  17. This is partially due to “saving face” after “completely fucking up.”

    Ham actually looked pretty devastated later in the game.

    Comment by Bab — October 4, 2012 @ 4:04 pm

  18. it reminded me of nelson cruz.

    the window has closed.

    Comment by Youppi! — October 4, 2012 @ 4:39 pm

  19. When he lays off those outside junkballs he can hit anything else with authority. When he looses a bit of bat speed say goodbye to that ability. And he’s 32 so it’s coming.

    Comment by TrappedInAfangraph — October 4, 2012 @ 5:17 pm

  20. agree 100% – been saying this all year.

    Comment by Delirium Nocturnum — October 4, 2012 @ 5:25 pm

  21. I don’t see how you can credit him with the full loss of win probability on that play. Then, essentially, that play (and any routine play hit to a fielder) would be a negative free roll. If you’re crediting the pitcher with most of the WPA for getting the easy fly ball, you have to at least factor in the marginal fielding win probability added for the actual completion of that play, and all other plays in the field he actually made that day. You can’t just pick and choose the one play he missed and pretend every fielder has ~100% chance of catching it. It’s not a fair use of a mean zero statistic if there is a play where he can only lose probability, but not gain any.

    Comment by Michael — October 4, 2012 @ 5:47 pm

  22. My best bet is that Hamilton heads out to the Marlins next year.

    http://i.imgur.com/otlB0.gif

    Comment by DA RAP GUY — October 4, 2012 @ 5:53 pm

  23. Holliday made a genuine error though on a more difficult play rather than a lazy effort. And it only allowed a player to get on base with two outs rather than allowing two to score.

    Comment by Toffer Peak — October 4, 2012 @ 6:34 pm

  24. You’re technically right but since CFs will make that play 99% of the time it ultimately doesn’t make a difference, particuarly since he rounded the WPA anyway.

    Comment by Toffer Peak — October 4, 2012 @ 6:36 pm

  25. Did you seriously just post joke about a man falling to his death?

    Comment by Toffer Peak — October 4, 2012 @ 6:38 pm

  26. Yes I basically agree, but he probably made some plays in the game that <99% of CF's make.

    Comment by Michael — October 4, 2012 @ 6:40 pm

  27. He’s going to get a silly contract and not even be in the league by 2015. Mark it down.

    Comment by Basebull — October 4, 2012 @ 6:55 pm

  28. The worst of it is, we have a defensively-gifted CF, Craig Gentry, who managed a 2.7 WAR in just 269 Plate appearances .

    The reason he only had 290 PAs and wasn’t in CF yesterday?

    Starting Gentry would mean the benching of defensively-challeneged Michael Young, who managed a NEGATIVE -2.4 WAR in 651 PAs.

    Gentry would’ve not only have made that catch, he wouldn’t have had to really, as we’d have had the AL West title wrapped up weeks ago had he been our starting CF.

    Comment by Tex Pantego — October 4, 2012 @ 6:56 pm

  29. It’s more than that. Talking Josh Hamilton gets complicated very quickly…

    Combination of outrageous natural talent, lack of commitment to fully develop such talent, and having enormous personal weaknesses that would cost the rest of humanity more than “a few years away from baseball…”

    We could elaborate.

    Comment by bloop triple — October 4, 2012 @ 8:40 pm

  30. I WISH I could give that 20,000 -’s. you truly are a p.o.s. that made, me much angrier than most trolling does. im almost speechless. examine yourself asshole. man what a prick you are.

    Comment by bpdelia — October 4, 2012 @ 10:01 pm

  31. yeah but dude the grit and veteran leadership. the been,there done that. the lead by examplism! the game face, HEART! DESIRE! you get 4 extra wins with gentry sure…but you get PRESENCE … VETERAN presence with Mike Young. you can’t overstate the value of an old guy sucking. it shows everyone else how to be a BASEBALL player.

    Comment by bpdelia — October 4, 2012 @ 10:06 pm

  32. You sort of did have the AL West title wrapped up weeks ago.

    Comment by Northhampstonstead — October 4, 2012 @ 10:42 pm

  33. Well he was only credited with 2 POs and 0 assists and both POs were in low leverage situations (2 outs no one on 5-1 in the 3rd; 0 outs no one on 9-5 in the 8th).

    He may have kept one or more runners from taking an extra base, but he didn’t catch any balls that added significant value to his team winning the game.

    Comment by Evan — October 4, 2012 @ 11:08 pm

  34. The Texas Rangers deserve everything they get for playing Hamilton and not benching Young.

    Comment by emptyhanded — October 4, 2012 @ 11:27 pm

  35. Anyone else read Bill Simmons’ history of the Golden State Warriors, “How To Annoy a Fanbase in 60 Easy Steps” (http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7714701/how-annoy-fan-base-60-easy-steps)?

    Of particular interest is point 7: “During the Cocaine Era (1977-1986), the Warriors somehow ended up with three of the league’s most notorious coke guys (King, Richardson and Lucas) and an interesting stigma: As legend had it, the Oakland Hyatt (where visiting teams stayed) was the best place in the league to score drugs, so struggling players routinely fell off the wagon during their Golden State trip. Oh, and if you’re scoring at home, the Warriors didn’t make the playoffs for nine straight seasons … from 1978 to 1986. Everybody lost in Oakland. Even the visiting players.”

    I believe teams stay in SF now, but one wonders if Oakland is still the city in which players are most probable to fall off the wagon.

    Comment by GMS — October 5, 2012 @ 12:31 am

  36. ron washington for sure

    Comment by david — October 5, 2012 @ 1:10 am

  37. You disgust me.

    Comment by Syl — October 5, 2012 @ 2:26 am

  38. A couple of things I am seeing this season from Josh that I have never seen before. First, his outfield play has drastically declined this year, especially in center. He’s lost at least a step from his MVP year. He’s never had the perfect routes but he could cover that up with his speed. Not anymore.

    He’s also lost any resemblance of a two-strike approach at the plate when he’s behind in the count. He used to consciously cut down his swing with two strikes to protect more of the plate. Now he is hacking no matter what the situation, unless he thinks he can get an RBI from a sacrifice fly or ground ball.

    Comment by Phantom Stranger — October 5, 2012 @ 2:57 am

  39. Eric Show.

    Comment by anatole — October 5, 2012 @ 5:42 am

  40. Not the “Rangers” really but more specifically, Ron Washington. Very few in the media seem to get the point about Wash, because the Dallas media never says a bad word about him. This is because most of the Dallas media loves Michael Young.

    One voice that is certainly anti-Wash is Keith Law. Hope he talks up more.

    Comment by Pfft — October 5, 2012 @ 5:45 am

  41. What’s “funny” is that in April – though he swung at everything – he hit everything. Inside, outside, in the dirt, over his head. He hit and killed everything. Opposite field and pulling it. I have never seen an individual hit the baseball like that and I don’t think I ever will again.

    And in the outfield in April, he caught everything. I’ll bet he dove 50 times in the outfield in April – caught everything. In April, he was more than Superman.

    After the 4 HR game in early May, Josh disappeared.

    Comment by Pfft — October 5, 2012 @ 5:49 am

  42. When the off-season comes around, I want a post explaining how to make these wonderful gifs.

    Comment by philosofool — October 5, 2012 @ 11:12 am

  43. Nope, both losses counted as one loss in the standings and, thus, were equally important, as was each other loss all season. Just because one was after the others doesn’t make it more important.

    Comment by Baltar — October 5, 2012 @ 12:26 pm

  44. A player actually sees the ball better if he moves toward it from a side angle than if he is waiting for it. I don’t know if there’s any difference between waiting for it or approaching it slowly from head-on, but I’m guessing there’s not.
    At first, both live and in the GIF, I though Hamilton was too casual in going after the ball after he missed it, but upon further viewing, I can see that he just had a hard time getting his footing after the unexpected miss.

    Comment by Baltar — October 5, 2012 @ 12:32 pm

  45. You are absolutely correct, Michael. Jeff should have stated the points you make in his post.
    The post was entertaining, but not really illuminating.

    Comment by Baltar — October 5, 2012 @ 12:45 pm

  46. The worst day in my baseball career? How about when I accidentally killed that fan I threw a ball to?

    Comment by Josh Hamilton — October 5, 2012 @ 2:14 pm

  47. It seems the Ranger outfielders are trying to go on to the
    next step BEFORE securing the ball. Cruz’s gaffe was
    similar to Hamilton’s. Cruz was trying to throw the ball
    BRFORE securing it. Whether they’re tired or just plain
    lazy, they get paid to execute as professionals. Their
    infield is pretty solid, with Beltre and Andrus as
    potential gold glovers. However, their outfielders need
    more work (where is their coach?). In a close pennant
    race and play-offs (and World Series), errors are
    magnified. With the Rangers pitching staff not being
    the best in baseball, excellent outfield defense is
    required. But let’s face it, Hamilton is NOT the
    Rangers’ best defensive centerfielder. He is a
    corner outfielder. By leaving him in center, the Rangers
    are asking for trouble, in the form of painful
    shortcomings or injury. What is BEST FOR THE TEAM
    always needs to be the Number One Priority! That is
    why Oakland is the West Division Champ. They played
    better as a team, and the TEAM was their first priority!

    Comment by Juan Chapa — October 5, 2012 @ 6:14 pm

  48. Some dumb owner will probably give him a $270 Million 6 Year
    contract, and then the dumb dufus will be thinking why his
    payroll keeps climbing and other players wanting outrageous
    contracts. The dumb owners are baseball’s biggest problem.
    Whatever stupid mistakes they make, all they have to do is
    sit around for several years, waiting for their team to
    appreciate in value, and then sell out.

    Comment by Juan Chapa — October 5, 2012 @ 6:26 pm

  49. What does it matter. The other players do not listen.

    Comment by Juan Chapa — October 5, 2012 @ 6:29 pm

  50. Washington has a defective philosophy about playing the
    players that got him there, in lieu of going with the hot
    hands. The objective is to win. By going with the
    “What Have You Done For Me Lately” mentality will keep
    the players on their toes. All the young players the A’s
    secured in trades made them contenders. Now,
    Hamilton is walking, and the Rangers will have nothing
    to show for him.

    Comment by Juan Chapa — October 5, 2012 @ 6:38 pm

  51. Remember, random variations? An error then is the same as an error in game one of the season.

    Comment by AlanB — October 6, 2012 @ 5:15 am

  52. While strictly true, it gets harder to see how that one works. Even within a game It is a little ham handed to say we have no idea how things would have gone, but between games…

    Comment by monkey business — October 6, 2012 @ 11:56 am

  53. Hey…why didn’t thermos call the infield fly rule on that play?

    Comment by Ted Spevick — October 6, 2012 @ 10:05 pm

Leave a comment

Line and paragraph breaks automatic, e-mail address never displayed, HTML allowed: <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong>


Current day month ye@r *

Close this window.

0.740 Powered by WordPress