In addition to being poor at throwing out runners, the Tigers pitchers are generally poor at holding runners (other than Verlander, who may possess the best RHP pickoff move in the MLB) and the Tigers don’t have many LHP either at the moment. This isn’t to say Martinez wouldn’t work here, just another variable to throw into the mix.
You consistently say ridiculous things. “Still one of the games best hitters”. He is one of the best hitting cathers in the game. Not one of the best hitters. Never has been, never will be. Couple that with his tremendously poor defense and you have a player that only makes sense to a team in desperate need of a catcher, like the Tigers. Certainly not a fit anywhere.
I agree with you that he’s not anywhere close to one of the best hitters in baseball, but he’s a valuable catcher. The offensive production he produces from the position is only matched by a couple players.
I wouldn’t want to give him a 4 year deal, but there’s a good chance he’s well worth his salary over the next two seasons.
I get the feeling that VMart’s bat doesn’t exactly play as well at 1B or DH than at C (well obviously)…combined with the fact that he is passable at best as a catcher, and likely won’t even be that in 2 years, I don’t see him getting as long of a contract as he wants.
Or if he does, it’s a dumb and/or nearsighted move.
Give him a 3 year with a club option for a 4th year. He needs to understand his numbers as a catcher, how old he will be during the contract and how that affects his health going forward. Also the Tigers could give a vesting option like they did with Magglio for VM’s 4th year. 5 years?? NO, only gammons would come up with that brain fart.
.844 OPS, only 52 ks to 40 walks, 20+ HR Guy in a full season’s at bat.
He’s one of the top pure hitters in the game. Fickle fans like you count maybe 20 hitters as the “top hitters”, but when you are dealing with a whole league full of teams with 25 man rosters, a guy like this qualifies as one of the top hitters.
Not all .844 OPSs are the same. A switch hitting guy who Ks only 52 times, while maintaining 20+ HRs is a different type of hitter than the .850 OPS, 3 outcome guy (HR, K, walk).
You saber morons like to oversimplify the game, and wonder why your models are incorrect so often. Watch a fucking game once in a while. You might actually learn something about the actual sport.
As for your use of “ridiculous”….it only seems ridiculous to your simple, 1 dimensional mind. You’re so stupid, the powers that be have managed to limit your scope to the extent that they can use your own brain against you.
Do you ever get tired of reading/writing the same thing over and over again?
Do you really think you know better than those that manage multi-billion dollar franchises that have existed for roughly a century? If not, did you ever think to question, “They’ve been doing this for a long time, yet they constantly seem to manage the business in such a way that seems illogical to me. Perhaps my logic is flawed.”
If you really want to learn something, first you need to accept that you don’t know it all. Based on the general feedback on this site, I’d venture to say that you don’t know ANYTHING.
this guy – With all due respect for your time and the thought that goes into your comments at Fangraphs I have to believe that you come to this site for one of two general reasons: either you see Fangraphs as a place to express your baseball opinions and analysis, or you love getting a rise out of people. If it’s the former, then you are welcome to talk baseball here (at least by me you are), but I suggest laying off of “saber morons” if you don’t want everyone that recognizes your name to immediately ignore your comments. If it’s the latter, then I would say you are very successful at what you do, I just hope you spread it around to other sites too. If you don’t fall into either category, then please feel free to explain because I’m curious.
I think his bat would play fine at DH, especially for a Tigers team that has gotten comically bad performance out of DH in the last two seasons. Even if you figure in a DH penalty, it would be a huge upgrade for Detroit.
Victor Martinez is a good DH,part time catcher,part time 1st baseman. If he goes to the national leg,he might be better off playing primarily 1st. He can prolong his career if he’s able to catch less. Good bat to have in the lineup,being a switch hitter. I’m sure if he stays in the AMERICAN LEAGUE, he could get a two or three year deal,but it has to be at 1st or DH.
I’d kind of like to see Alex Avila have another year (well, a full year) at catcher for the Tigers. Also, I think that Jayson Werth is undervalued; I think that he’s get a contract less than what he’s really worth. Maybe the Tigers can use him in LF/RF with Brennan Boesch. Boesch strikes me, both statistically and subjectively, as about a league average player in his prime. That’s valuable since he’s cheap, but he’s not Babe Ruth like a lot of people were saying in the first half of the year.
V-Mart SB rate year was deceiving since it was most apparent in April when Red Sox pitchers/coaches made virtually no effort to control the running game and his CS% hovered around 10% (as was Variteks). Once improvement was made in this area by the coaching/pitching staff, V-Marts CS% increased to 26%. Also, the running game is more efficient in the AL east with the Yankees and Rays, so his SB% should increase with Detroit. The Royals and White Sox run but they get caught a lot.
Also, Cabrera started only 148 games at 1B. V-Mart can take those 14 games, and another 25 at DH and play 120 games at C.
I don’t see V-Mart as getting an AAV more than 12-14 million, but he will want 4-5 years, so even when he can’t catch well enough near the end of the deal, and they don’t need a DH or 1Bman, he can still be traded to a team in need of a 1Bman if they eat some salary. He won’t make enough to have an unmovable contract, especially if salaries spike again in the next few years..
Catchers who can hit are a rare commodity, and V-mart will be a significant upgrade offensively at catcher for the next 2-3 years when he will more than earn his salary, possibly enough to compensate for the tail end of any deal. More years, less AAV. Fewer years, more AAV.
Without reading the article to this I can answer the question as: No.
Also, everybody should have stopped listening to Peter Gammons when he tried to convince people that he had heard the Tigers would be dumping Cabrera to the Red Sox. I don’t think some Red Sox fan from off the street is a credible source Peter.
Yes, yes, they’ve been congresspeople and senators for a long time. They MUST know more about economics than you do!
They’ve been in business as brokerage houses for a long time. They MUST be more competent at managing money than you are!
And so on. Anyway, Martinez may be only just passable at catcher, but his “just passable” is dramatically better than most when combined with his hitting. I can easily see a GM stretching a little to give him 3 years with a vesting option, and the deal working out well for both sides.
Regrettably, I do have to say that Gammons does seem to have gone downhill. As a Red Sox fan, at one point he seemed to have some occasional insider info and useful analysis, but I feel like it’s degenerated into random conjecture and homerism for a while now.
Glad to see the Tigers have a ton of money coming off the books. V-Mart would be a good fit but don’t go crazy with the deal. Carl Crawford(looks like Anaheim is the favorite) or Jayson Werth would obivously be a better bet. If they are looking for more power and not much of a drop off in defense Werth should be who they target.
Wonder where the Donkey Winds up? Either side of Chicago?