You could do the same thing for batters and figure out which batters are the slowest and then figure it out from there. I think it’s possible to do, but more difficult and I imagine over the course of an entire season it’s probably going to even out for pitchers/batters, but I could be wrong.
I think the difference is in how pickoffs are handled. I think Beyond is just ignoring any data point that involves a pickoff attempt (I’m not 100% certain though)
This should only impact pitchers with “throwover-itis” (Buchholz comes to mind).
Not sure if it’s worth looking at men on vs noone on splits… someone like Beckett is absolutely painful to watch with men on and I suspect his pace is impacted by his ‘pickoff’ philospohy…. just hold the ball forever and then get upset when the batter asks for time.
Nice. Want to play around? How about looking at pace vs. LI, or pace vs. base-out state? My gut tells me that some pitchers slow down a lot when there are men on, regardless of their bases-empty pace. It would be nice to see what the data has to say about that.
Particularly like the idea of pace v LI, and then comparing FIP in those situations to bases empty FIP; does the pitcher get better results working quicker/slower or does he crumble under the pressure of runners on base?
But I’m a White Sox fan so I get to see a lot of fast workers. I’ve seen Garza and Sabbathia who used to be in the division. I’ve seen Carlton Fisk behind the plate. Those 4 seconds can seem a lot longer. It’s a matter of tempo and how long you have to look around at everything else between pitches.
Also, your math is inaccurate. Each pitcher throws roughly 100 pitches (200 total) so it’s 14 minutes or almost the length of an entire inning. If it is coach/team dependent, you may be able to extend it to the bullpens so you are talking about maybe 300 pitches per nine inning game or 20 full minutes per game.
In football there are substitutions on both offense/defense, and plays must be called into one player and then shared with the other 10 players on each side of the ball. There’s also only 60 minutes to work with in a football game, so taking time between plays doesn’t extend the length of the game, it just reduces the total number of plays per game. With baseball you must record 27 outs, and as this study shows some guys take an excrutiating amount of time to record those 27 outs (or atleast their portion of the 27).
Old school baseball thinking says that if pitchers work faster, their defenders play better behind them. It would be interesting to attempt to correlate pitcher pace with BABIP or a defensive metric, to see if this holds true.
Comment by GiantFaninDodgerLand — November 18, 2010 @ 12:47 pm
I remember when Buehrle would face Mark Mulder when he was good and on the A’s. Those games were over in the blink of an eye and I think it really made the games more enjoyable.
I agree that organization likely plays a key role in pace, but the fact that the 5 slowest pitchers are all in the AL East makes me suspicious that the proclivity of opponent batters to step out of the batter’s box is heavily correlated. Is it possible to normalize these results for opponent team? How do pace times compare when playing an AL East team vs all other teams?
That part of the argument isn’t relevant to the AL East point. The pitcher wouldn’t need to have been developed in the AL East for the more methodical batting approaches in that division to have an impact on the pitcher once he began pitching in the division. Who developed the pitcher isn’t critical to that argument.
As a Rays fan, and I’m just speculating with no evidence, the Yankees and Red Sox are absolutely the most glacial hitters in the world. Derek Jeter, Kevin Youkilis, Alex Rodriguez, David Ortiz, all have intricate rhythms in between pitches, and all have high pitch counts. Part of the effect is that you’re dealing with a cast of better hitters to begin with. Fewer divisions have the depth of payroll (and resulting power) that the AL East possesses. As a result, you get longer, more patient ABs, better ability to defensively foul off two-strike pitches to extend said ABs, better eye on borderline pitches.
Again, nothing concrete behind this argument, just observation; games in the AL East are longer than games outside the division. A large portion of that impact has to be due to the batters. And if that can be empirically verified, it would be likely that the pitcher’s origin within the division would not be as critical as merely pitching in the division.
Former pitcher Dave Baldwin, who received an advanced degree in bio-mechanics, holds that because the mind holds the image of the last pitch for several seconds, that it is harder for the batter to re-calibrate for the next pitch if the pitcher throws quickly enough. Balwin’s theory was that the mental image of the last pitch would confuse the batter if the pitcher worked quickly, that the batter cannot completely adjust to the next pitch if his mind is in any way still focused on the last pitch. So there could be a physiological foundation for pace improving the performance of the pitcher, unless of course the pitcher continues to throw the same pitch.
I see that this article was written in 2010 and I was wondering if the Pace that can be downloaded as a custom report on the FanGraph site
is calculated the same way as written in the 1st paragraph of this article?
If it is calculated differently, does anyone know how?
Comment by skillz25 — September 17, 2014 @ 10:16 pm
The words “FanGraph site” is a link to the custom report.
Comment by skillz25 — September 17, 2014 @ 10:18 pm