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  1. Good article but… you forgot to mention Edwin Jackson anywhere. I think he is the Jackson you refer to in the 3rd paragraph. As it is, it sounds like you’re talking about Austin Jackson there.

    Comment by Mike N — June 30, 2011 @ 2:08 pm

  2. Good catch. Fixed.

    Comment by Joe Pawlikowski — June 30, 2011 @ 2:15 pm

  3. How good would they look if they’d kept Haren?

    Comment by Sam — June 30, 2011 @ 2:22 pm

  4. It seemed pretty obvious he was talking about Edwin Jackson considering he said “no hitter be damned” and the Diamondbacks never owned Austin Jackson

    Comment by mdmckirgan — June 30, 2011 @ 2:26 pm

  5. The way things are going, they’re looking good enough to win the putrid NL-West even without him.

    Comment by Terrence — June 30, 2011 @ 2:29 pm

  6. Not really an answer.

    Comment by Nik — June 30, 2011 @ 2:36 pm

  7. I remember last year that everybody said that the D’backs lost that trade, me included… That’s why we shouldn’t rush labeling this kind of trades. In a similar way, the prospects in the Haren trade are performing really well, and Tyler Skaggs projects to be a No. 2 starter at least, though with Haren they’d be the team to beat in that division.

    Comment by KK85 — June 30, 2011 @ 2:45 pm

  8. Haren is the most overrated pitcher in the game. I’d bet money he has a 3.50 to 4 ERA when the season ends, yet people continually act like he’s an ace. One only needs to see him pitch in a high pressure game to reach this conclusion.

    Comment by Jason — June 30, 2011 @ 2:55 pm

  9. *Insert Pro-Haren rant here* Blargh ramble K/9 BB/9 FIP etc.

    Ohhhh wait…. funny guy.

    Dan has nothin on Joe Saunders, who is the left-handed embodiment of a “winner”

    Comment by mbrady16 — June 30, 2011 @ 3:01 pm

  10. Maybe 3-4 wins better?

    Comment by marcello — June 30, 2011 @ 3:01 pm

  11. The article may have made a stronger point had the Dbacks not traded away Haren for a box of scraps…

    Comment by Larry — June 30, 2011 @ 3:12 pm

  12. Sorry, but the article and the comments seriously undersell how fantastic the 2 deals (Scherzer/Jackson and Haren) were. In addition to netting Daniel Hudson for Edwin Jackson, the Dbacks also got LHP David Holmberg who is up to 34 consecutive scoreless innings and a 2.39 ERA as a 19 YO in A ball.

    In the Haren deal, the DBacks got 2 very promising LHP in 19YO TYler Skaggs (3.38 ERA in A Ball) and 21YO Patrick Corbin (4.17 ERA in AA). Even Joe Saunders has his uses as a league average innings-eater.

    But it doesn’t end there – Haren is making $12.75M this year. Saunders i overpaid at $5.5M but the savings to the DBacks is something like $5M this year and goes up a bunch once Saunders is gone with Haren signed for 3 more years.

    Comment by Anon — June 30, 2011 @ 3:54 pm

  13. If he has a 3.50 ERA and doesn’t miss any starts, is he an ace? (the answer is yes, IMO)

    Comment by Danmay — June 30, 2011 @ 4:05 pm

  14. As a White Sox fan I thought the Jackson-Hudson was a terrible trade at the time and apparently it was (for the White Sox).

    Comment by Drew — June 30, 2011 @ 4:08 pm

  15. Didn’t Arizona stupidly fire the GM who assembled this team? I will say that, as a baseball fan in my mid-thirties, it is so great to see Roy Hobbs, uh, I mean Kirk Gibson managing a MLB team!

    Comment by Robbie G. — June 30, 2011 @ 4:15 pm

  16. For all the gain of Ian Kennedy and Daniel Hudson, it seems the Saunders-Haren move is trying to negate it, unless Tyler Skaggs does well.

    Comment by My echo and bunnymen (Dodgers Fan) — June 30, 2011 @ 5:47 pm

  17. ‘putrid’? I think the giants and rockies both have a lot of talent (even if the rockies haven’t played well). 3 good teams in the division -> it’s not putrid.

    Comment by brendan — June 30, 2011 @ 5:58 pm

  18. Haren’s ERA and ERA- in each of the past 5 years (making basically every start):

    3.07 (70)
    3.33 (74)
    3.14 (71)
    3.91 (93)
    2.85 (75)

    Other than his sub-par year last year (for the first 2/3 of the season in arizona really), he’s been durable and consistently excellent. Ignoring any of the advance stat stuff, you’re still just kinda wrong.

    Comment by Matt — June 30, 2011 @ 6:08 pm

  19. Hyperbole much? I’d say Haren is not as “overrated” as Jared Weaver, Alexi Ogando, or this year’s Josh Becket. He’s certainly not as overrated as Tommy Hanson, and he’d be less overrated than Gio Gonzales if anybody was paying enough attention to Oakland for anybody to rate anything about them.

    Comment by joser — June 30, 2011 @ 9:01 pm

  20. They would have lost that trade had they not found a bigger idiot to give them surplus value for Edwin Jackson.

    Comment by JamesDaBear — June 30, 2011 @ 9:35 pm

  21. How does that trade have any impact on trading Scherzer for Jackson and trading Jackson for Hudson?

    Comment by JamesDaBear — June 30, 2011 @ 9:36 pm

  22. Jason-
    did you even bother to do any analysis to back up your ridiculous claim?
    If you did, you wouldve realized you were flat out wrong, and saved yourself the embarrassment of posting such utter drivel

    Comment by cs3 — June 30, 2011 @ 11:23 pm

  23. I think he trails only Roy Halladay in wins among active pitchers.

    Comment by Jerry Dipoto — July 1, 2011 @ 3:50 am

  24. Certainly in years past, but I think the bar’s been raised a bit in the last 18 months. There are 50 qualifying starters with an ERA under 3.5 at the moment. (43, if you want to use a FIP of 3.5 instead).

    There’s no real agreement on the definition of ace, but I think being one of the top 30 starters in baseball is a minimal qualification. So, as it looks now, a player with a 3.5 ERA/FIP would have to have to have an unusually high number of IP to be a candidate for ace-dom.

    Comment by Bhaakon — July 1, 2011 @ 6:09 am

  25. It doesn’t make much sense to bring up the saving when Haren is worth twice as much or more than he’s being paid. The D-Backs will have an extremely hard time investing that cash in such a way as to bring a better return than Haren provides. Unless they plan on pocketing that money, but that’s a different argument.

    Comment by Bhaakon — July 1, 2011 @ 6:15 am

  26. They didn’t fire the guy that did the deals, but they did pass on giving him the GM job. The deals were done by Jerry DiPoto who was passed over for the GM job, but remains with the team. In hindsight, I think both the deals done last year were good for the dbacks. Getting legitimate prospects (and an innings eater) for Haren, without having to contribute at all to his owed salary, was a great deal when you consider it was done when the team was playing awful yet still had an overpayed pitcher who was underpermormong greatly at the time. It goes without saying that the Hudson deal was great for the team. The teams surprising success this year is simply a bonus as when the deals were done, I don’t believe anyone thought the team would be in contention this quickly.

    Comment by Eddy — July 1, 2011 @ 5:00 pm

  27. Maybe it is just me but I think the Dbacks will always lag with 250 hitters in center and right. I’ll give you Upshow is hitting now but when he goes into those 35 day finks…wow. An he is dangerous in the outfield. Then first base another sun 230? Someone should show them how to drive to Tempe. How many ASU players are starting and non with the Dbacks, and Willie is what I mean. The only one with nads are the coaches, they need to kick rather than pat butts.
    Paying through the nose for tickets

    Comment by Desert — July 2, 2011 @ 10:07 pm

  28. How much of a troll are thee? Let me count the ways. Nah, there’s too many to list before the end of the holiday. Somebody should show you how to spell and use basic grammar.

    Comment by Oasis — July 3, 2011 @ 11:23 am

  29. “certainly not as overrated as Tommy Hanson”? Someone has to overrate him for him to be overrated. Most people in the mainstream underrate him.

    Comment by Antonio Bananas — July 3, 2011 @ 5:45 pm

  30. post of the year

    Comment by David — July 5, 2011 @ 1:59 am

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