FanGraphs Baseball


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  1. The top 6th spot in the nl is the marlins not the phillies think you got the colors confused

    Comment by hanser — July 13, 2011 @ 4:13 pm

  2. Isn’t that actually Granderson who leads the #2 hitters in wOBA?

    Comment by Duke The Dumpster Droese — July 13, 2011 @ 4:18 pm

  3. Your Semi-Pro line – .000/.429/.000

    But, you are the king of three true outcomes (or, two, I guess) with 100% of your plate appearances ending in one.

    Comment by Semi Pro — July 13, 2011 @ 4:20 pm

  4. My guess is that he’s never swung the bat.

    Comment by Yirmiyahu — July 13, 2011 @ 4:35 pm

  5. Hmm. Must’ve misread the book, but im farily certain Tango said #2/4 is where the most balanced and important hitters go, with #2 getting the edge b/c of the larger nbr of plate appearances. Again, could be wrong b/c its been a few years since I’ve read it and talked batting order, but can anyone confirm?

    Comment by Jeffrey Gross — July 13, 2011 @ 4:40 pm

  6. Ha! Sure enough! Good catch!

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 13, 2011 @ 5:02 pm

  7. I’ve never made contact, but my Swing % is something like 8%.

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 13, 2011 @ 5:03 pm

  8. Without cracking the book to check, I thought it was 1/2/4, 3/5. 6,7,8,9, with no specification of order within the groups, except to say that ISO should be in the 4 slot and OBP in the 1.

    Comment by Telo — July 13, 2011 @ 5:04 pm

  9. Yeah, that’s accurate. In terms of avoiding out (read: good OBP) it goes 1, 4, 2, etc. 2/4 are the most important overall.

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 13, 2011 @ 5:05 pm

  10. Two boners in one post! Whelp, time to take that color blindness test.

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 13, 2011 @ 5:06 pm

  11. PS – what does “semi-pro” mean? I think the word you looking for is amateur. There’s nothing to be ashamed of.

    Comment by Telo — July 13, 2011 @ 5:06 pm

  12. More single-digit HR totals in the clean-up spot than I would’ve guessed. Though only the Mariners (of course) project to finish the season with fewer than 10 from the #4 hitter.

    Comment by joser — July 13, 2011 @ 5:08 pm

  13. “Mariners (of course) project to finish the season with fewer than 10 from the #4 hitter.”




    Comment by Telo — July 13, 2011 @ 5:10 pm

  14. Good on the Twins, having the confidence to put forward an NL-like 8- and 9-spot!

    Comment by V — July 13, 2011 @ 5:14 pm

  15. 226 of Vernon Wells’ 257 ABs this year have come as the #4 or #5 hitter in the Angels’ lineup.

    Comment by D4P — July 13, 2011 @ 5:43 pm

  16. It’s not amateur in that a number of players are one their way to play in college or were previously drafted/scouted by the MLB. I imagine I would have a hit in an amateur league.

    It’s more of a summer league.

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 13, 2011 @ 5:50 pm

  17. While Granderson does have the highest in the #2 slot, I bet the Sox’s wOBA there would be a lot higher if Alexei had played all the past games in the 2 spot.

    Comment by SP Ver2.0 — July 13, 2011 @ 6:03 pm

  18. 1st – Jose Reyes
    2nd – Curtis Granderson
    3rd – Jose Bautista
    4th – Matt Holliday/Kevin Youkilis
    5th – David Ortiz
    6th – Mike Stanton/Jhonny Peralta
    7th – Josh Thole
    8th – Gordon Beckham
    9th – Marco Scutaro/Robert Andino

    Did some quick looks at the highest wOBA and this is what I came up with.

    Comment by Robert — July 13, 2011 @ 6:05 pm

  19. A little off topic, but:

    How pointless was it to put the DH rule in an NL park last night during the ASG??

    It’s not like pitchers have ever really hit in the ASG before. The reserve position players pinch-hit for the pitcher and then a new one comes in. Why the DH rule?

    Pointless! At least when you choose the pinch hitter for the pitcher with NL rules, you can put in the best hitter for the offense and against the current opposing pitcher considering the situation at hand.

    Having a DH left the teams with a designated person in the lineup when they could have chosen from ANY of the reserves with NL rules. It didn’t even make any difference in the score of the game (5-1, still a low score). Stupidity! Where does Selig come up with these dumb ideas??

    NL park should have NL rules.

    Comment by Templeton1979 — July 13, 2011 @ 7:11 pm

  20. I don’t think the DH created any more AL fans (Yankees were already the most popular AL team even before the rules changed in 1973) and the NL teams didn’t lose any fans due to it either. Increased popularity has come with championships (Look at the Giants, Phillies and Red Sox in the past few years) not from having or not having the DH rule.

    Comment by Templeton1979 — July 13, 2011 @ 7:12 pm

  21. In reality, it looks like most MLB managers go with conventional wisdom for lineup construction and not the run simulators. The major concern seems to be breaking up spots in the lineup by handedness, to combat specialty relievers like LOOGY’s. I wonder if a team would ever be willing to put a recognized slugging machine like Jose Bautista batting first, even though his OBP indicates he should be there.

    Comment by Phantom Stranger — July 13, 2011 @ 7:59 pm

  22. Actually, 1,2,4 are equal in quality. More walks 1, 2, then 4. More extra base hits 4, 2, then 1.

    Comment by Ben Hall — July 13, 2011 @ 8:46 pm

  23. I’m not sure what the problem is, there’s nothing you can do in an NL game that you can’t do in an AL game. You can sub for the DH like anyone else, and you can move your DH into the field and stop using one whenever you want.

    Comment by Judy — July 13, 2011 @ 9:17 pm

  24. Holy shit, Oakland.

    Comment by Ian — July 13, 2011 @ 9:22 pm

  25. very very well written. actually laughed out loud at the betancourt/integration jokes. many props

    Comment by jts5 — July 13, 2011 @ 10:47 pm

  26. woodrum rebounds from that retarded ‘women’ article with an-all time classic here. this article is pure fangraphs, fangraphs at its finest. excellent read.

    Comment by jim — July 13, 2011 @ 10:59 pm

  27. Jays did this to start last year. Bautista batted leadoff in April. But it’s not just his OBP you talking about. His power is wasted at the leadoff spot since he will come to bat even more often with nobody on base. At least that’s what conventional wisdom would say if your worst OBP guys are batting 8 and 9.

    Comment by Philly — July 13, 2011 @ 11:24 pm

  28. lol, boners

    Comment by Brian — July 14, 2011 @ 12:10 am

  29. I do not think the word “whence” means what you think it means.

    Comment by J — July 14, 2011 @ 12:24 am

  30. I know, right?

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 14, 2011 @ 12:27 am

  31. Boy, I sure use it a lot too. Oh well, most modernites don’t know its real meaning anywho.

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 14, 2011 @ 12:28 am

  32. Thanks! I aim to please!

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 14, 2011 @ 12:29 am

  33. Great article!
    Was a little surprised the Red Sox’ 3rd spot trails the 4th and 5th in terms of wOBA – still being hurt by Crawford’s April ‘tear’ i guess?

    Comment by MV — July 14, 2011 @ 6:09 am

  34. “Am I the next Bautista? Probably.”


    Comment by Ted Williams Head — July 14, 2011 @ 8:27 am

  35. May I join your summer team league?

    Comment by Milton Bradley — July 14, 2011 @ 9:00 am

  36. So you can’t get a hit off of high school kids.

    Comment by Telo — July 14, 2011 @ 9:25 am

  37. Man, that Rangers lineup is balanced. Only team with all 9 above .300. They could put them out there in any order and still score a lot of runs.

    Comment by Calm Like A Bomb — July 14, 2011 @ 9:42 am

  38. Perhaps FG can add batting order in the splits to check this stuff out on our own?
    And I think there is something wrong with sorting by team/position. For the Cubs, center field appears to take all of Reed Johnsons plate app’s into consideration, and right field ALSO takes all of Reed’s plate app’s into consideration, as does left field. Can’t it be so that only his CF PA’s go into the Cubs CF stats?

    Comment by Norm — July 14, 2011 @ 9:58 am

  39. Nope. Not yet. :)

    Comment by Bradley Woodrum — July 14, 2011 @ 10:39 am

  40. Woodrum, could you please write an article on the effect of SABR knowledge on amateur summer league softball/baseball? Maybe do a survey of some of the fangraphs writers and assess their approaches to plate discipline and other SABR-friendly concepts. I, for one, have taken to the Brett Gardner approach in my amateur games, but I still get batted 9th at times. :(

    Comment by d — July 14, 2011 @ 11:06 am

  41. As a big fan of Bruce Bochy, I have to congratulate him on putting his best batters at #5 and #6, and his tied for sixth best at #3. What a genius!

    Comment by GiantHusker — July 14, 2011 @ 11:33 am

  42. How do you go about putting together data like this? Aggregated by batting order position (or by fielding position)

    Comment by Patrick — July 27, 2011 @ 12:04 pm

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