Comments on: Let’s Stop Burying The Living http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/ Daily baseball statistical analysis and commentary Sun, 12 Feb 2012 23:34:21 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: lester bangs http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-83479 lester bangs Sun, 05 Jul 2009 01:28:41 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-83479 I agree with Swyck. Remember, all fading stars come around, except those that don't. Bring back Richie Sexson! I agree with Swyck. Remember, all fading stars come around, except those that don’t. Bring back Richie Sexson!

]]> By: Mitch W http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-83403 Mitch W Fri, 03 Jul 2009 18:20:46 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-83403 THank you. Took me a while to get back to where I asked this question! THank you. Took me a while to get back to where I asked this question!

]]> By: nick http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82086 nick Thu, 25 Jun 2009 03:26:48 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82086 yeah, and why were they heavily suspected? because they suddenly started to suck! so what's your point? yeah, and why were they heavily suspected? because they suddenly started to suck! so what’s your point?

]]> By: Per http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82078 Per Thu, 25 Jun 2009 01:54:30 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82078 Pretty much all the guys you use to illustrate your point are sluggers heavily suspected of juicing. Pretty much all the guys you use to illustrate your point are sluggers heavily suspected of juicing.

]]> By: wobatus http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82051 wobatus Wed, 24 Jun 2009 20:24:10 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82051 Yeah, damn, I thought it was time for a throw some dirt on Vlad Guerrero thread. What is he, 78 years old now? Yeah, damn, I thought it was time for a throw some dirt on Vlad Guerrero thread. What is he, 78 years old now?

]]> By: wobatus http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82046 wobatus Wed, 24 Jun 2009 18:58:35 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82046 BTW, to steal a line, players go bad like people go bankrupt: two ways-slowly and then suddenly. BTW, to steal a line, players go bad like people go bankrupt: two ways-slowly and then suddenly.

]]> By: wobatus http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82034 wobatus Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:32:47 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82034 would the Mets go from say 35-34 record with him to 32-37 without him, or would it be 33.5-35.5. The whole "games above/below .500 conundrum. :) would the Mets go from say 35-34 record with him to 32-37 without him, or would it be 33.5-35.5. The whole “games above/below .500 conundrum. :)

]]> By: wobatus http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82031 wobatus Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:27:40 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82031 Don't be so logical swyck. Who do you think you are, Branch Rickey? :) Don’t be so logical swyck. Who do you think you are, Branch Rickey? :)

]]> By: wobatus http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82029 wobatus Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:26:48 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82029 Maybe teams were worried he'd revert a la Fernando Tatis. Unfair, as Fernando has hit into bad luck. I am just pissed as a Mets fan because he has hit into a zillion DPs this year Maybe teams were worried he’d revert a la Fernando Tatis. Unfair, as Fernando has hit into bad luck. I am just pissed as a Mets fan because he has hit into a zillion DPs this year

]]> By: wobatus http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/lets-stop-burying-the-living/#comment-82027 wobatus Wed, 24 Jun 2009 17:23:20 +0000 http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=5766#comment-82027 Giles has had deteriorating performance for years now. last year he blipped up a bit, this year down a bit but the overall trend has been down. His ISOs 2004 .190 2005 .182 2006 .134 2007 .145 2008 .150 2009 .080 Homers 2004 23 2005 15 2006 14 2007 13 2008 12 2009 2 wOBA 2004 .366 2005 .393 2006 .342 2007 .338 2003 .376 2009 .251 A couple of babip spikes to .320 and .321 in part explain '05 and '08 upticks in wOBA, as those are above his career norm and even his good Pirate years. And it isn't all Petco, as he used to hit more homers on the road than he does all year as a Padre. And a platoon season or 2 babip spike for Spiezio when he was 33 as an example that players don't slowly decline. Sure, they don't usaully fall off a cliff, sans injury, but old players decline and sometimes get injured, usually (eventually inevitably). Ortiz is having a nice little June and no doubt he may have been "buried" prematurely. His ISO has still gone from .349 to .290 to .243 to .157. Season isn't over yet but he seems a decent bet to finish below .243 this year. And maybe he will pop back up next year, even as a slightly heavy 34 year old, a time when guys of his body type of lore used to slow down a little bit. Delgado had been injured in '07. Took him a while to snap back. I do not dispute the general tone of the article. Hard to say definitively when a guy is kaput. I think Spiby read the article and may have been kidding around a bit. But to me, Giles is on the road to done. He may have a nice little snap back but the decline pattern is pretty blatant. And I know there was a lot of defense of him, that he was worth the option, $9 million, WAR above 4 or whatever last year. I think that ignored somewhat the general decline pattern and vested a lot on the spike last year in his value. Can he bounce back? I guess. I wouldn't want to waste a spot on my team seeing if he will. Giles has had deteriorating performance for years now. last year he blipped up a bit, this year down a bit but the overall trend has been down.

His ISOs

2004 .190
2005 .182
2006 .134
2007 .145
2008 .150
2009 .080

Homers

2004 23
2005 15
2006 14
2007 13
2008 12
2009 2

wOBA

2004 .366
2005 .393
2006 .342
2007 .338
2003 .376
2009 .251

A couple of babip spikes to .320 and .321 in part explain ’05 and ’08 upticks in wOBA, as those are above his career norm and even his good Pirate years.

And it isn’t all Petco, as he used to hit more homers on the road than he does all year as a Padre.

And a platoon season or 2 babip spike for Spiezio when he was 33 as an example that players don’t slowly decline. Sure, they don’t usaully fall off a cliff, sans injury, but old players decline and sometimes get injured, usually (eventually inevitably).

Ortiz is having a nice little June and no doubt he may have been “buried” prematurely. His ISO has still gone from .349 to .290 to .243 to .157. Season isn’t over yet but he seems a decent bet to finish below .243 this year.

And maybe he will pop back up next year, even as a slightly heavy 34 year old, a time when guys of his body type of lore used to slow down a little bit.

Delgado had been injured in ’07. Took him a while to snap back.

I do not dispute the general tone of the article. Hard to say definitively when a guy is kaput.

I think Spiby read the article and may have been kidding around a bit. But to me, Giles is on the road to done. He may have a nice little snap back but the decline pattern is pretty blatant. And I know there was a lot of defense of him, that he was worth the option, $9 million, WAR above 4 or whatever last year. I think that ignored somewhat the general decline pattern and vested a lot on the spike last year in his value.

Can he bounce back? I guess. I wouldn’t want to waste a spot on my team seeing if he will.

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