Boy this sure was a heated debate. I still think Halladay should’ve won. He was toe to toe with Lee in just about every category. He was also ahead in these: 9 CGs to 4 for Lee, 4.72 run support vs 6.13, 2 more starts, lower WHIP, 23 more IP, better K/BB, better K/9, lower P/PA, lower P/IP, way better GB/FB ratio, lower opp. OPS and OBP, way lower opp. BA, higher AGS (avg game score), the highest PRC (pitching runs created) – tied with Lee, best adjusted FIP – Lee was 6th, 2nd most quality starts in AL with 23 – tied with Lee, and a better ERC (Component ERA) and ERC%

What put Doc over the top was the much much tougher competition and his awful run support as shown here: (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3700775&name=Neyer_Rob) and here: (http://www.baseballprospectus.com/unfiltered/?p=1012).

Anyway, for people arguing about traditional statistics, how about the COMPLETE GAME?

Roy had 9 this season. That is simply remarkable, in this era of pitch counts.

If you look at defense-independent stats like FIP, xFIP, tRA, etc, Lee comes out a bit ahead on most, and Halladay’s advantage in IP and degree-of-difficult doesn’t quite make that up, although it’s pretty close. Toronto is actually a slightly better park for hitters than Cleveland these days, but both are right near average.

Halladay certainly deserves nearly the same level of recognition as Lee does, but the real story should be how nobody’s at all close to these two guys. Calling Lee a no-brainer Cy Young winner isn’t using your brain.

You ever wonder how they determined who won the Cy Young before all those lame brained stats that you all mention were even thought up? Did they only focus on W-L back in the early days of the award? Because they didn’t factor in any of those stats you all bow down to, and kiss your own balls for, does that make those pitchers any worse or better than that history has shown them to be?

So, lets get back to the old school way of things and leave all the pansy ass stats at home for those modern day idiots claiming to know all about baseball cuz of the numbers … what counts? The fact that Halladay has factored in 30 of his 32 starts (either win or loss) where as Lee has only done so in 24 of 30. Halladay has 8 complete games, Lee only 4. As a true pitcher you always want to stay out and be a factor in the game for as long as possible and Halladay instills that belief in his fellow players, coaches and opposition. When you play against Halladay you know you’re up for one of the harder games you’ll have to play in during the season and if you’re on his team you know that you’ve got a chance to win no matter what line-up the oppostion throws at you.
To turn around from a 2-4 April … to only let opponents get 10 or more hits just twice in a season (Lee six times) against you … to hummiliate your opponents 201 times while only getting burned 18 times yourself … to carry yourself from the field in the way Halladay does and to be the face of a franchise in the way he’s been … that’s the mark of a true winner.

You can whine all you like about stat this and stat that but you don’t know what it’s like to face a pitcher like Halladay (neither do I by the way but I would hang my head as I trudged out to face his onslaught of pitches.) He is the last of a dying breed as players and owners and fans get obsessed by cash and stats and cream their pants every time their favorite player gets mentioned in some lame internet news article. Give me a break. I’d rather loose those 11 games and have Halladay on my team any day than ride a 20+ win season the way Lee has been doing.
If you really like the game of baseball then go out to a freaking ball park, start watching instead of analysing each number as they flash by on your MLB.com GameDay screens. Live for the dust and grass, or unfortunately in Halladay’s case the patchy green carpet around him, and get your fucking faces away from that lame computer screen you’re staring at at this very second.

Those are my two cents … now let the dissargreements roll on (looking for a couple Stevo) … I’ll read them when the season is over as I wanna catch as much of the real game as possible while drunkenly filling out that silly stat sheet sitting in the bleachers … if you see me at the ballpark, I like extra cheese on my nachos! (don’t forget the beer)
take care all
-Bart.