<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	xmlns:itunes="http://www.itunes.com/dtds/podcast-1.0.dtd"
xmlns:rawvoice="http://www.rawvoice.com/rawvoiceRssModule/"
	>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: The Winter of Pitching&#8217;s Discontent</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/</link>
	<description>Daily baseball statistical analysis and commentary</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 13 Feb 2012 00:21:02 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jack</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123601</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 03:32:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123601</guid>
		<description>http://seattle.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2005/02/28/story1.html

&quot;Major League Baseball controls all the revenue streams from broadcasting and merchandising outside the United States and Canada. That means the Mariners, despite being home to one of Japan&#039;s most popular players, must split the revenue from the Japanese market equally with the rest of the league&#039;s 30 teams.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://seattle.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2005/02/28/story1.html" rel="nofollow">http://seattle.bizjournals.com/seattle/stories/2005/02/28/story1.html</a></p>
<p>&#8220;Major League Baseball controls all the revenue streams from broadcasting and merchandising outside the United States and Canada. That means the Mariners, despite being home to one of Japan&#8217;s most popular players, must split the revenue from the Japanese market equally with the rest of the league&#8217;s 30 teams.&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123583</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Jan 2010 01:27:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123583</guid>
		<description>Not really, 

Meche has been a decent signing and all the other signings listed on this list were viewed in a vacuum except for one... 

It&#039;s not secret that FanGraphs doesn&#039;t think Dayton Moore is smart. I&#039;m a Royals fan and I have more than enough doubts myself. 

It just reeks a bit of childish piling on when little snide marks like this are made. 

Critism of Dayton Moore moves should be reserved for when he does make questionable moves. And there will be plenty more opporutnity for that. 

It doesn&#039;t need to be mentioned in an article about a poor free agent pitching class when Dayton Moore actually out performed his peers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not really, </p>
<p>Meche has been a decent signing and all the other signings listed on this list were viewed in a vacuum except for one&#8230; </p>
<p>It&#8217;s not secret that FanGraphs doesn&#8217;t think Dayton Moore is smart. I&#8217;m a Royals fan and I have more than enough doubts myself. </p>
<p>It just reeks a bit of childish piling on when little snide marks like this are made. </p>
<p>Critism of Dayton Moore moves should be reserved for when he does make questionable moves. And there will be plenty more opporutnity for that. </p>
<p>It doesn&#8217;t need to be mentioned in an article about a poor free agent pitching class when Dayton Moore actually out performed his peers.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Nathaniel Dawson</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123557</link>
		<dc:creator>Nathaniel Dawson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 23:46:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123557</guid>
		<description>&quot;Therefore, the incentives that you are talking about would be a violation of the CBA&quot;

I&#039;m not seeing anywhere where he said that the incentives would be based on performing metrics. Are you reading something into it that isn&#039;t there?

As for the highly incentive based contracts, most players don&#039;t like them because there&#039;s less guaranteed money. The players most likely to accept such deals are players that have had recent injury problems, such as Glaus, Sheets, Harden. You wouldn&#039;t be able to attract most free agents with that kind of approach.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Therefore, the incentives that you are talking about would be a violation of the CBA&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not seeing anywhere where he said that the incentives would be based on performing metrics. Are you reading something into it that isn&#8217;t there?</p>
<p>As for the highly incentive based contracts, most players don&#8217;t like them because there&#8217;s less guaranteed money. The players most likely to accept such deals are players that have had recent injury problems, such as Glaus, Sheets, Harden. You wouldn&#8217;t be able to attract most free agents with that kind of approach.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: CircleChange11</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123534</link>
		<dc:creator>CircleChange11</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 22:52:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123534</guid>
		<description>2 things jump out at me on this list ...

[1] Does Dave Duncan get a % of the money he helps guys get in FA? (Suppan and Weaver).

[2] Did OAK know that Zito and Mulder were hurt or on their way down?

The cardinals traded Haren for Mulder, which in hindsight looks horrific. At the time StL had all 5 starters throw 200 IP. Still Haren&#039;s minor league &#039;control&#039; and &#039;hard to hit&#039; numbers were there, with just a cup of coffee in MLB. Mulder was supposed to be the new version of John Tudor and turned out to be damaged goods, like the time StL signed Danny Jackson.

I also see Woody Williams who the cards let walk after &#039;04. Williams had a decent season with SDP in 06 (12-5 3.68), but saw his IP and K&#039;s fall significantly in his SDP years. HOU was likely putting too much stock in the Woody they saw with the Cardinals up to the 04 season, and ignored the drop-off in 05 and 06.

When are teams going to ralize that when you sign a &quot;Dave Duncan project&quot;, he&#039;s not going to perform as well for you as he did for him? Maybe they have, Pineiro is still unsigned.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>2 things jump out at me on this list &#8230;</p>
<p>[1] Does Dave Duncan get a % of the money he helps guys get in FA? (Suppan and Weaver).</p>
<p>[2] Did OAK know that Zito and Mulder were hurt or on their way down?</p>
<p>The cardinals traded Haren for Mulder, which in hindsight looks horrific. At the time StL had all 5 starters throw 200 IP. Still Haren&#8217;s minor league &#8216;control&#8217; and &#8216;hard to hit&#8217; numbers were there, with just a cup of coffee in MLB. Mulder was supposed to be the new version of John Tudor and turned out to be damaged goods, like the time StL signed Danny Jackson.</p>
<p>I also see Woody Williams who the cards let walk after &#8217;04. Williams had a decent season with SDP in 06 (12-5 3.68), but saw his IP and K&#8217;s fall significantly in his SDP years. HOU was likely putting too much stock in the Woody they saw with the Cardinals up to the 04 season, and ignored the drop-off in 05 and 06.</p>
<p>When are teams going to ralize that when you sign a &#8220;Dave Duncan project&#8221;, he&#8217;s not going to perform as well for you as he did for him? Maybe they have, Pineiro is still unsigned.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: nilodnayr</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123470</link>
		<dc:creator>nilodnayr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 21:12:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123470</guid>
		<description>Some of the players were failures due to injuries, but many just sucked.  Incentives can only be placed on things like games played, etc, not performance metrics.  Therefore, the incentives that you are talking about would be a violation of the CBA.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Some of the players were failures due to injuries, but many just sucked.  Incentives can only be placed on things like games played, etc, not performance metrics.  Therefore, the incentives that you are talking about would be a violation of the CBA.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: nmh</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123423</link>
		<dc:creator>nmh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 19:21:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123423</guid>
		<description>Just off the top of my head, it would seem that some small market teams (Royals, Nationals, Pittsburgh) could not get away with this &quot;incentive&quot; tactic. In fact, the reason that Meche received the payday he got probably had a lot to do with the fact that it was the Royals who were courting him. If a team like the Cubs or maybe even the Giants were offering him a contract, it could ostensibly take less money because the location/situation is more desirable. Again, this would be on a case to case basis, but we need only to look at the most recent Bengie Molina contract. Molina supposedly took less money and possibly time to play in a place he was comfortable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just off the top of my head, it would seem that some small market teams (Royals, Nationals, Pittsburgh) could not get away with this &#8220;incentive&#8221; tactic. In fact, the reason that Meche received the payday he got probably had a lot to do with the fact that it was the Royals who were courting him. If a team like the Cubs or maybe even the Giants were offering him a contract, it could ostensibly take less money because the location/situation is more desirable. Again, this would be on a case to case basis, but we need only to look at the most recent Bengie Molina contract. Molina supposedly took less money and possibly time to play in a place he was comfortable.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Al Dimond</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123379</link>
		<dc:creator>Al Dimond</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 17:44:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123379</guid>
		<description>It seems to me that the article claims that the winter of 2006 might go down as the worst free-agent pitcher-signing winter of all time -- of ALL TIME!

Given the impressive list of big-dollar signings you&#039;ve listed, and the complete failure of many of them, it could well be true. But without (a) adding in the good contracts signed that winter as well and (b) maybe giving the numbers for other free-agent pitcher-signing winters we just don&#039;t know. It&#039;s just gawking at bad contracts... if you took the worst contracts of every season and added them up you&#039;d probably get a number similar to $53 mil/win.

Aaron Miles, Yuni Betancourt, and Ronny Cedeno combined for a wOBA of .225 last year (made-up number). I wouldn&#039;t include that fact in an article about how 2009 was a terrible year for middle infielders, I&#039;d look up the numbers of all 2009 MI.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems to me that the article claims that the winter of 2006 might go down as the worst free-agent pitcher-signing winter of all time &#8212; of ALL TIME!</p>
<p>Given the impressive list of big-dollar signings you&#8217;ve listed, and the complete failure of many of them, it could well be true. But without (a) adding in the good contracts signed that winter as well and (b) maybe giving the numbers for other free-agent pitcher-signing winters we just don&#8217;t know. It&#8217;s just gawking at bad contracts&#8230; if you took the worst contracts of every season and added them up you&#8217;d probably get a number similar to $53 mil/win.</p>
<p>Aaron Miles, Yuni Betancourt, and Ronny Cedeno combined for a wOBA of .225 last year (made-up number). I wouldn&#8217;t include that fact in an article about how 2009 was a terrible year for middle infielders, I&#8217;d look up the numbers of all 2009 MI.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: NBarnes</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123362</link>
		<dc:creator>NBarnes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 17:29:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123362</guid>
		<description>Part of my point is that even if you spread out the posting fee over the six years of the contract, it&#039;s still the best contract on that list, and not by a little.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Part of my point is that even if you spread out the posting fee over the six years of the contract, it&#8217;s still the best contract on that list, and not by a little.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jimbo</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123347</link>
		<dc:creator>Jimbo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 17:01:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123347</guid>
		<description>In light of this, I&#039;m astonished at the lack of incentive-based contracts. Not for the big budget teams...they can make a bad deal and brush it under the rug with another player. 

But for the mid and small market teams, isn&#039;t it theoretically possible to give so much in incentives that you actually might attract &quot;slightly&quot; better talent? And if your guaranteed salaries come in under $30M, with the potential to wind up three times that amount--of course, that would likely result in contention.

Basically, I&#039;m wondering why smaller budget teams haven&#039;t been more creative in finding ways to pay-per-win.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In light of this, I&#8217;m astonished at the lack of incentive-based contracts. Not for the big budget teams&#8230;they can make a bad deal and brush it under the rug with another player. </p>
<p>But for the mid and small market teams, isn&#8217;t it theoretically possible to give so much in incentives that you actually might attract &#8220;slightly&#8221; better talent? And if your guaranteed salaries come in under $30M, with the potential to wind up three times that amount&#8211;of course, that would likely result in contention.</p>
<p>Basically, I&#8217;m wondering why smaller budget teams haven&#8217;t been more creative in finding ways to pay-per-win.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: geo</title>
		<link>http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/the-winter-of-pitching-discontent/#comment-123346</link>
		<dc:creator>geo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 20 Jan 2010 16:59:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/?p=14628#comment-123346</guid>
		<description>I get the point, although I would submit that the Cubs got just as lucky with Lilly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I get the point, although I would submit that the Cubs got just as lucky with Lilly.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

