Who Do the Players Find Overrated?

For the player poll that will appear in the July 19th edition of Sports Illustrated and is now online here, 187 players responded to the question of who is the most overrated player in the Major Leagues. To me, it’s always interesting to see how players evaluate other players, and how they perceive how those of us outside the game evaluate them. This question sort of kills these two birds with one stone, although the question is also very vague. Are these players overrated by other players? By GMs? By fans? By writers? Let’s dive in and take a look at what the players answered.

#5: J.D. Drew, 3%

J.D. Drew has been a point of contention between the sabermetric analysts and much of the mainstream media for a good bit now. Typically, we don’t side with the players here. Dave Cameron says that Drew has been worth the money, and I defended the contract here. The fact is, Drew is a fantastic player when he’s on the field, and despite the time that he misses, he remains one of the best right fielders in the league. Drew put up 4.0 WAR in 2008 and 4.8 in 2009 and is on pace to go over 4.0 once again in 2010 (and he might even reach 600 PAs this time!).

Why would the players think he’s overrated? Honestly, that’s a good question. I have a feeling that it is because he misses time, and the machismo aspect of sports would lead the players to believe that anyone that is injured as often as Drew can’t possibly be worth that much. However, I have a hard time placing Drew as “overrated” because he seems to be almost universally panned by the mainstream media, who complain about his contract, work ethic, and injuries multiple times every year.

#4: Nick Swisher, 4%

Another interesting choice, this one comes on the heels of Swisher’s first All-Star selection. I would think that Swisher is underrated, if anything, as he was traded for Wilson Betemit, the player equivalent of a bag of balls. Swisher has been consistently solid and has really turned it up this season, with a career high .391 wOBA and 2.7 WAR through only 360 plate appearances this year. That’s certainly All-Star caliber production.

Why would the players find him overrated? Swisher doesn’t exactly have the most fantastic body, and he doesn’t (usually) hit for a great average. There also seems, as you might notice as we continue, to be a bit of an anti-Yankees feel to this list. There also could be some hard feelings from the .219 batting average he put up with the White Sox in 2008. Swisher certainly isn’t your typical All-Star or even your good player, but his production for the last few years is hard to ignore.

#3: Gary Matthews Jr., 5%

This one is spot on. Matthews basically parlayed one decent year and one fantastic catch into a $50 million contract and whined when he couldn’t get playing time with the Angels. Why would he be considered overrated, after the Mets finally dumped him last month? Possibly because he managed to make the opening day lineup for the Mets in center field, despite the fact that he’s just plain not good: GMJ has posted a total of -1.1 WAR since 2007.

The players find him overrated for the same reasons we do: he’s bad, overpaid, and somehow manages to keep finding roster spots. The Reds signed him to a minor league deal recently, so there’s still a chance that Matthews’ MLB career isn’t over.

#2: Alex Rodriguez, 5%

Is Alex Rodriguez actually overrated? Over his career, no chance. If we look at the last few seasons, possibly. At age 35, Rodriguez has posted a staggering 106.0 WAR in his career. That has him in the top 25 position players of all time and he should have at least a few good seasons left in him. Even recently, Rodriguez has been excellent, even though a 4.7 WAR season in 2009 doesn’t live up to his contract. Still, he posted 6.0 WAR in 2008 and a staggering 9.2 WAR in 2007. He has the ability to remain a premiere player, even though his 2.2 WAR so far this season doesn’t live up to that.

The reason for Rodriguez’s spot on this vote seems simple to me: the contract and the steroid use. Rodriguez easily makes the most of any player in the game right now and is quite clearly not the best player in the game: that would be Albert Pujols, and there are certainly arguments to be made on a number of other players too, including Chase Utley and Hanley Ramirez. Throw in the steroids and I’m actually surprised that Rodriguez wasn’t number one. There’s three easy ways to be a hated baseball player: get a huge contract, use steroids, and play for the Yankees, and Rodriguez has all of those down.

#1: Joba Chamberlain, 12%

Joba “wins” — and in a landslide. Given the hype surrounding his ascent to the Major Leagues, the fact that Chamberlain isn’t the dominant pitcher that we expected is certainly disappointing. His ERAs the last two years of 4.75 and 5.79 certainly fuel that fire, but Chamberlain has actually pitched pretty well this year according to his peripherals. His FIP is below 3.00 and his tERA and xFIP are both below 3.40. Given the hype, it’s disappointing that Joba is settling in as a pretty good middle reliever, but it would be hard for me to say “most overated in baseball.”

But the players almost certainly see the hype and the media frenzy surrounding Chamberlain’s arrival, combined with the fact that some of them have hit him around this year, and the decision for them is simple. Not only that, but much has been made of Joba’s emotions on the mound, which could certainly irk some players on opposing teams. Given that perfect storm, I’m not terribly surprised to see Chamberlain on this list, although I am surprised that he is first by such a wide margin.



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Jack Moore's work can be seen at VICE Sports and anywhere else you're willing to pay him to write. Buy his e-book.


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Bill Baer
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6 years 1 month ago

3 Yankees, 1 Red Sox (Sock?), 1 Met

Sounds about right to me!

Slugger27
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Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

only 1 of the yankees deserved to be there… and the 1 sox player didn’t deserve to be there either

Lou
Guest
Lou
6 years 1 month ago

Gary Matthews Jr hasn’t been a met for a while. Hes somewhere in Cincinnati’s minor league system

walklightwhite
Member
walklightwhite
6 years 1 month ago

No surprises, really. These are same players who think Jeter is the most underrated.

But, really. Considering J.D. Drew receives hate from his -own- fans and media, how anybody can think he is ‘overrated’ is beyond me.

Sixto Lezcano
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Sixto Lezcano
6 years 1 month ago

Derek Jeter didn’t make the top 5?

Slugger27
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Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

he’s the best offensive SS in the past 85 years. 2nd if you count arod.

Bender
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Bender
6 years 1 month ago

No he isn’t. Hanley and Nomar are better (although you can disagree with Hanley because he’s young, but truly, Hanley’s offensive prowess at SS is amazing).

Slugger27
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Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

“No he isn’t. Hanley and Nomar are better (although you can disagree with Hanley because he’s young, but truly, Hanley’s offensive prowess at SS is amazing).”

….huh?

nomar career batting runs = 226 (while ignoring 5 years of that was spent away from SS
hanley career batting runs = 174

derek jeter career batting runs = 388

i’m confused with what you’re using to measure these guys with.

Will
Guest
Will
6 years 1 month ago

“i’m confused with what you’re using to measure these guys with.”

Maybe he’s looking at the fact that Jeter has over three times the number of plate appearances as Ramirez but less than double the number of batting runs.

If you take Jeter’s best four year stretch, 1998-2001, he was worth 160.3 runs.

In Ramirez’s only four full seasons he’s been worth 158.4 runs, and he’s still only 26 years old. He’ll get better.

Garciaparra’s best 4 year stretch, 1997-2000, was worth 156.2 runs.

You’re comparing apples to oranges by just using career batting runs when player A has 10,200 plate appearances and player B has 3,100. Hanley Ramirez is well on his way to being the best offensive SS ever.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

since when do we NOT use career numbers to measure all time greats???

by that logic, tim lincecum is a better all time pitcher than greg maddux. after all, lincecum’s numbers is his first 2.5 years are better than maddux’s 20 year avg.

when talking about the best all time at a position, you cant say “Hanley Ramirez is well on his way to being the best offensive SS ever.” hell, then troy tulo is officially the 2nd best offensive SS ever.

i guess you were one of the people that said carlos baerga was one of the all time greats…

::rolls eyes::

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

And Jeter is one of the worst defensive SS’s ever to get the amount of attention he does. Which is why on recent past polls such as this he’s come out a “winner” as the most overrated.

Doogolas
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Doogolas
6 years 1 month ago

Did someone really say one of the worst defensive shortstops ever? Sure he’s had some atrocious years, but his career UZR/150 is only -4.9. While that’s bad I’m extremely doubtful that it’s one of the worst ever. And really, I’m just not sure how much I trust the much older metrics. UZR still has it’s own problems, things before it just scream ridiculous to me. Nonetheless, I’m doubting -6.8 runs per year defensively at SS is even still one of the worst all time. And on a per game basis Jeter’s -.049 per pales in comparison to:

Dunston: -.068
Ricky G: -.11
Hanley: -.051
Gomez: -.091
Duncan: -.101

I mean, those are just a few. I’m sure I could find a lot, lot more guys that are crappier shortstops. Jeter isn’t a great defensive shortstop by any stretch. But I wouldn’t put him down as one of the worst of all time territory. I’d be willing to bet there’s a good 50 guys that are crappier on a per game/per season basis fairly easily.

Doogolas
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Doogolas
6 years 1 month ago

Forgot one thing, yes, I am aware that even if he’s 51st that’s very, very bad. I just threw a number out there. But it’s in reference to “of all time.” If you’re the 50th best hitter of all time for a position you’re not one of the best hitters of all time at your position really. Being 50th best just doesn’t mean anything.

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

Wow, doogolas. You really need to brush up on your reading. It would save you a lot of huffing and puffing. I never said Jeter was one of the worst defensive SS’s of all time. I said “Jeter is one of the worst defensive SS’s ever TO GET THE AMOUNT OF ATTENTION HE DOES.” The part in all caps is the important qualifier which you’ve somehow neglected to comprehend.

This goes directly to the issue of being “overrated” which the second sentence of my post refers to and which is a term some in this thread have trouble defining. I think in the context of this poll “overrated” means not playing up to a hefty contract and/or hype. (In Jeter’s case, I would say he doesn’t live up to either.)

So, in light of that, how do the other shortstops you named, except for maybe Hanley, qualify as getting the amount of attention that Jeter does?

As for Hanely, while highly lauded, he doesn’t even get the same amount of attention/hype Jeter does. So even though he’s another lousy fielder like Jeter, I don’t really think that he is overrated. And he is a better hitter than Jeter (better career wOBA).

Even though they are not relevant to my original point, where are you getting UZR/150 numbers for players of the past like Duncan and Dunston?

Alireza
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

I think the backlash against Drew is more because he appears to be a legit a-hole.

Swisher’s issues probably stem from the fact that he was supposed to be a big time CFer coming into the league, but clearly has never been much defensively outside 1B.

walklightwhite
Member
walklightwhite
6 years 1 month ago

Really? I’ve never seen anything about Drew being a legit a-hole. Most of the criticism, at least from Bawston fans/media, tends to come from his low average/RBI and the belief that he refuses to play with minor injuries other guys play with.

Daern
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Daern
6 years 1 month ago

I follow the Sox pretty closely, and the one thing I’ve never heard among all the complaints against Drew is that he’s an asshole. I’ve heard laziness, fragility, general poor play, and a lack of caring, but never that he was an asshole.

zzzz
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zzzz
6 years 1 month ago

Really what you described sunds more like a Douche Bag, but definitely not an a-hole

Miles
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Miles
6 years 1 month ago

His history of contract negotiations and the PR stemming from that is the reason for my personal contempt. In a way, he’s also a proxy for Boras-hate.

He might appear to be an a-hole to some, but I think it’s more that he appears to lack commitment, honesty, and/or integrity.

walklightwhite
Member
walklightwhite
6 years 1 month ago

So, are you a Phillies or Dodgers fan?

Sixto Lezcano
Guest
Sixto Lezcano
6 years 1 month ago

I have a feeling there isn’t a lot of Boras-hate among players.

Alex
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Alex
6 years 1 month ago

I’ve never heard that. He seems to take more crap for his quiet demeanor and lack of emotions than anything.

James
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James
6 years 1 month ago

I agree with the other posters. He has never been described as a a-hole or anything close. He is a family guy who still lives in a small town in Georgia and is a well known Christian. Only thing people dislike is his toughness

Matt
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Matt
6 years 1 month ago

Flawed logic of the day:

Hitler was a Christian. J.D. Drew is a Christian. Hitler was an A-hole. Therefore, J.D. Drew is an A-hole.

kevinM
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kevinM
6 years 1 month ago

Does Joba even make 1% of the combined 2010 salaries of the other 4 players?

NYMIKE
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NYMIKE
6 years 1 month ago

Who actually thinks Gary Matthews is good? Even my Mets knew that he was a waste of spot. Arod overrated? Players are jealous.

Bronnt
Member
Bronnt
6 years 1 month ago

Waste of a spot, yet he got a spot. I’d say that’s a completely legitimate definition of overrated.

Rich
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Rich
6 years 1 month ago

Arod is probably the 6th or 7th best 3B in the AL, and makes 30M a year. Of course hes overrated.

I mean, frankly, there’s 3 better 3B in HIS DIVISION (Beltre, Youkilis, and Longoria), none of whom even make half of what he does.

bonestock94
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bonestock94
6 years 1 month ago

Beltre

Tom Zig
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Tom Zig
6 years 1 month ago

6th or 7th best 3B in the AL? You cannot be serious. The only 3Bs putting up a better year offensively this year are Beltre and Longo. Oh and Youkilis = not a 3B. Over his career he was played 1500 innings at 3rd while over 4500 at first.

Jason B
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Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

Yeah, I would agree with Tom…I don’t have Alex man-love by any means, but 6 or 7 better 3B in the AL?? Beltre?!?! C’mon now. =)

The list of 3B with more value over their career is not likely to include Longoria, Wright, Zimmerman, or any other 3B presently playing. More value over the last 3 years, or 5 years, probably doesn’t include any of them, either. More prospective value going over the next 3-5 years? Debatable, but again a very short list, and he’s on the downside of a very long and illustrious career, and still quite productive at that (even if not up to A-rod standards, and even if the declining production isn’t really worth $30 mil per).

Besides, it’s not his fault the Yankees overpaid for him (nor Jeter that they overpaid for him, nor Burnett, etc). They’re the Yankees; it’s what they do. And they’re not the only team that pays for past performance, rather than future. (They just do it best?)

Rich
Guest
Rich
6 years 1 month ago

Defense counts too, and Arod is Bad to Very Bad.

He currently has the 6th highest WAR among 3B… in the AL, and that doesn’t count Youk, who is better defensively at 3B than he is.

Rich
Guest
Rich
6 years 1 month ago

Arod’s value over his career isn’t relavent in a discussion on whether or not hes a great 3B right now.

He’s not a 1.000 OPS player anymore, and hes not a SS anymore. He’s a defensively worse than average 3B who OPS .880

Slugger27
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Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

wait… why do ppl keep bringing up youkilis? he doesnt play 3b.

what am i missing…?

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

“The list of 3B with more value over their career is not likely to include Longoria, Wright, Zimmerman, or any other 3B presently playing. More value over the last 3 years, or 5 years, probably doesn’t include any of them, either. More prospective value going over the next 3-5 years?”

Since the start of the 2008 season up to now (2-1/2 seasons), both Longoria and Wright have a higher WAR than A-Rod, and Zimmerman is essentially tied with him (12.9 for A-Rod vs. 12.8 for Zimmerman). I would bet that all 3 put up a better WAR than A-Rod over the next 3-year period and 5-year period.

Tom Zig
Guest
Tom Zig
6 years 1 month ago

I’m not sure what list you’re looking at, but according to WAR leader board, only 4 3B are ahead of him this year. Michael Young is .1 WAR ahead, which is negligible and Jose Bautista has played 3 different positions this year (500 innings in the OF, 265 innings at 3B). So I’m sure if you were to look at his WAR just at 3B it’d be a lot lower than ARod’s. So really my point still stands, there are only 2 3B that are truly better than him this year. I bet A-Rod finishes second on the year.

Jason B
Guest
Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

I know, I love that we’re using 1/2 season (an admittedly down season by his standards) to argue that he’s now worse than players like Adrian Beltre. Never mind his career 152 wRC+. .410 career wOBA. 106 career WAR. Which all indicate that he’s among the ten or twenty best players ever.

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

“So really my point still stands, there are only 2 3B that are truly better than him this year.”

Why include only the AL? If you include all third basemen in both leagues, A-Rod is just the 8th best at his position so far this year. Clearly overrated considering the contract and the hype.

Mat Gonzales
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Mat Gonzales
6 years 24 days ago

Yes Mike, he makes more than 1 percent of their salaries.

RoyaleWithCheese
Member
RoyaleWithCheese
6 years 1 month ago

Damn. I was really hoping to see Ryan Howard’s name.

Jason B
Guest
Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

I agree – he gets a lot of dollars and a lot of trophies because of a fascination with context-dependent counting stats.

Mark
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Mark
6 years 1 month ago

How can Howard be overrated? He started at the All Star Game (!!!) and he is clutch with runners on by hitting lots of home runs…if anything, he’s underrated. I mean he won rookie of the year AND he was an MVP! How can an MVP be overrated? And he’s improving his defense! AND he won a WS ring. So he’s a consistent run producer who’s a winner.

jscape2000
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

I think you just made the case for why Arod can’t be overrated…

Jason B
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Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

Haha right on Mark. Right on.

Steve
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Steve
6 years 1 month ago

Joe Morgan?

Greg
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Greg
6 years 1 month ago

Jesus. And you wish you had him on your team.

Sometimes the statheads are so impractical about things.

Mike Francesa
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Mike Francesa
6 years 1 month ago

But.. but.. But.. He gets der RBIZ! and he’s got that nice smile! How can you not love him!

Derek
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Derek
6 years 1 month ago

I get the feeling Howard’s not in the top five because he seems to have a pretty good reputation as a person/citizen and has never been mixed up in steroid allegations or player drama. Whether they admit it or not, the top five is clearly influenced by more than just the quality of play by these guys.

Sergio
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Sergio
6 years 1 month ago

I think some of the Drew out lash might still be from when he held out and was re-drafted. I’ve always thought of him in that light.

zbelair
Member
zbelair
6 years 1 month ago

The list pretty simplys seems to me as a jealousy issue to me: big markets hype and contracts for a non superstar (besides arod).

I think a more interesting question is who the people here at fangraphs think are the most overrated players? I can only think of Jeter who fans think is the greatest defender of all time because of that damn jump throw.

zbelair
Member
zbelair
6 years 1 month ago

yadier molina too based on his all-star start…

Mat Gonzales
Guest
Mat Gonzales
6 years 1 month ago

was anyone even MILDLY surprised by Joba Chamberlain topping this list?

The guy was a media sensation despite being lights out for less than 100 innings in his career.

bonestock94
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bonestock94
6 years 1 month ago

Completely surprised. Maybe because I’m thinking in salary terms…or I’m biased.

Tom B
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Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

that’s right, a MEDIA sensation. no one hyped joba. he was not “supposed” to be good. he wasn’t a “can’t miss” prospect.

how the hell can he be overrated?

bonestock94
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bonestock94
6 years 1 month ago

Maybe I’m just not that in tune with the mainstream media, but has he even been getting that much coverage in the past couple of seasons?

Tom B
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Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

He pitched 17 innings that changed his career. He’ll spend the next 5 years trying to live up to those 17 innings.

Rich
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Rich
6 years 1 month ago

He was at one point projected by BP to have the lowest ERA in the league among starters.

Jonathan
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Jonathan
6 years 1 month ago

The mainstream media hasn’t really talked about him much the last year and a half, but in 2007 and a sizable chunk of 2008? People were calling him a can’t miss prospect and calling him the best Yankee farm product since Jeter. If you asked your average Yankee fan in early ’08, Joba was the heir apparent to Rivera and/or a perennial potential Cy Young candidate in the offing.

Basically, the last three years have been either “HUGHES IS OMG BEST EVAR” or “OMG JOBA IS BEST EVAR” back and forth from a lot of the Yankee fanbase. When your fanbase is as large as theirs, you get a lot of people considering the player overrated.

Ed
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Ed
6 years 1 month ago

Baseball America ranked Joba the #3 prospect going into 2008, behind only Bruce and Longoria. His fastball used to regularly hit 100, with a high 80s slider. He absolutely was a can’t miss top prospect.

Sean L
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Sean L
6 years 1 month ago

I was going to say I’m surprised Ryan Howard didn’t make the list, but after a second’s reflection, I’m not at all surprised. Even though he’s not even going to be worth his contract this year—and will probably perform further below his pay-grade in the years to come—he’s still going to be good for 120 RBI and 35-40 home runs. Players eat that stuff up.

As usual though, very good analysis from Mr. Moore. I still can’t really make sense of Swisher, but I think the cries of Yankee/batting-average bias are probably on the money.

PL
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PL
6 years 1 month ago

Ryan Howard is the worst player with the most accolades in the history of the game. He never deserved his MVP and his ASG appearances have been questionable at best.

Bill
Guest
Bill
6 years 1 month ago

I have a hard time believing that. Every year he’s made the All Star team, he has arguably deserved it and I agree that he did not deserve his MVP over Pujols, but worse players have won MVP’s. How could you forget Mickey Cochran in ’34? His OBP was 40 points lower and his slugging percentage was 250 points less Gehrig, who had won the triple crown that year. Howards OPS in ’06 was 200 points higher than Cochran’s.

don
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don
6 years 1 month ago

Howard wasn’t the worst MVP in 2006.

Tom B
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Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

This list is completely useless. How do you poll 1/10th of the league for an over-rated list?

Let’s talk about who’s ACTUALLY overrated? Overrated as in they are supposed to be GREAT players, but are not.

Joe Mauer.
Troy Tulowitzki.
Grady Sizemore.
Adam Jones.
Jacoby Ellsbury.
Ichiro.
Jimmy Rollins.
Pablo Sandoval.
Adam Lind.
Aramis Ramirez.
Curtis Granderson.
Chone Figgins.
Nate McLouth.
Wandy Rodriguez.
Josh Beckett.
Ricky Nolasco.
James Shields.
John Lackey.
Papelbon.

Funny how none of these guys are on the list, I guess they must have been the ones that voted.

PL
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PL
6 years 1 month ago

Explain how Ichiro is over-rated. Do it now.

Tom B
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Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

A mountain of singles does not make a great player. He is great at it, and don’t get me wrong he will be in the HoF… but for a complete lack of power, he gets way too many at bats for the number of runs he scores.

It’s a reach, sure, but no more than some of the others on my list.

Rich
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Rich
6 years 1 month ago

Ichiro has been a 5 WAR player for the last 10 years. If that isn’t great, I don’t know what is.

Jason B
Guest
Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

People think Nate McLouth is still awesome?!? Someone quick! Go tell him!

I don’t think Ichiro nor Mauer are overrated. Ichiro perhaps underrated for the very reason you mention – he’s a singles hitter, and chicks (and probably players, and the media) dig the longball. As someone already pointed out, 5 WAR a year over a decade is hard to call ‘overrated’.

Mauer, perhaps if people expected a decade of him repeating last year’s numbers. I think everyone expected some regression; maybe not this much, but he’s 1/2-year into an 8-year deal? Give him time. Also, be sure to consider his stats in the context of catchers and their expected production.

RoyaleWithCheese
Member
RoyaleWithCheese
6 years 1 month ago

Wow. Many of those are good players who are having uncharacteristically bad years. Looking at the last three months of a player’s career and assuming that is his true talent level is foolish, to say the least.

Tom B
Guest
Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

Yeah, that’s not what I did.

At all.

RoyaleWithCheese
Member
RoyaleWithCheese
6 years 1 month ago

It isn’t? Mauer, Sandoval, Lind, Ramirez, Granderson, Figgins, McLouth, Rodriguez, Nolasco, Shields, Lackey, and Papelbon have all underperformed significantly this year. That didn’t factor into your list? Not at all?

Sizemore, Ellsbury, Rollins, and Beckett have missed significant time due to injury. I’m not sure whether that counts as underperforming or not.

That said, I can see the argument that some of these players (mainly Beckett and Lackey) have always been overrated.

Tom B
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Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

Whats the point of making a list of overrated players that are having good seasons?

quincy0191
Guest
quincy0191
6 years 1 month ago

“Whats the point of making a list of overrated players that are having good seasons?”

An overrated player having a good season is still overrated. Dontrelle Willis was overrated for a long time.

Tom B
Guest
Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

right, but we didn’t find that out until he had 3 awful season in a row. “overrated” is not a snapshot in time.

RoyaleWithCheese
Member
RoyaleWithCheese
6 years 1 month ago

“Whats the point of making a list of overrated players that are having good seasons?”

I didn’t. That’s a list of good players having bad seasons (or not as good as usual, in Mauer’s case). Whether you’ll admit it or not, you’ve deluded yourself into thinking they are not good anymore. Or, that they never were good in the first place.

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

This is an excellent overrated list except Aramis and Ichiro. Look at Aramis’ #s over the past 6 years or so, and build a list of more consistently dominating hitters. It’s a very short list, and it consists of the handful of elite players in the game. He isn’t Arod, but to call him “overrated” is ridiculous.

A dominant lead off hitter is the most effective weapon in the game, outside the most dominant power hitters (Bonds, Miggy Pujols, etc.). Add in defense that’s as good as the human race has to offer, and I don’t understand how you place him on this list. A speedy, intelligent .380 OBP or higher atop the order, defense and pitching has, and always will be, the most efficient way to a World Series title.

I’m impressed you had the sense to add Mauer. His “legend” is comical at this point. They stole signs and he hit some HRs one year. He’s being compared to Pujols. It’s a joke. He’s a slight offensively upgraded “Chone Figgins” minus the speed.

Sixto Lezcano
Guest
Sixto Lezcano
6 years 1 month ago

Chone Figgins minus the speed… I must have forgotten, when did Figgins have his 8.0 WAR year while playing the hardest position in the game and only playing in 138 games?

Snuckles
Guest
Snuckles
6 years 1 month ago

I think every baseball fan is beyond sick of the media’s 24-hour love affair with Nate McLouth and Ricky Nolasco.

McLouth, McLouth, McLouth!

Nolasco this, Nolasco that! Every minute with the Nolasco!

STOP THE MADNESS!

Sixto Lezcano
Guest
Sixto Lezcano
6 years 1 month ago

Joe Mauer had the best season by a catcher in the history of baseball. Yep, he stinks.

Rick
Guest
Rick
6 years 1 month ago

Tulowitzki is overrated?? How?? youre crazy

Joe
Guest
Joe
6 years 1 month ago

How is Joe Mauer overrated? Best catcher in baseball. Could have three MVP’s, yet only has one. Maybe he will be overpaid during the latter years of the contract, but arguably the best player in baseball. And I don’t see how that is overrated.

Justin Mosovsky
Guest
Justin Mosovsky
6 years 1 month ago

I can see people calling Mauer overrated, but Tom saying he isn’t a great player… This is a down year compared to last year and he is STILL leading all AL catchers in WAR, (third overall). I guess being top 3 at your position isn’t enough to be considered great, you have to be best at your position if you catcher and not have drop offs in production ever. I guess it is unacceptable to go from best by a mile over the course of a full year to top 3. If Joe Mauer isn’t great, then I guess you either have to say Olivio, (1st in WAR) and McCann (2nd overall) is great if you even want to be able to call any catchers great. I mean, Mauer has track record on a lot of people and those 2 are the only ones beating him now.

Justin Mosovsky
Guest
Justin Mosovsky
6 years 1 month ago

I meant 3rd overall among catchers, not to imply he was 3rd in the AL in WAR, bad phrasing.

Kirkwood
Member
Kirkwood
6 years 1 month ago

Adam Jones.
Jacoby Ellsbury.
Jimmy Rollins.
Curtis Granderson.
Chone Figgins.
Ricky Nolasco.
Josh Beckett.
John Lackey.

Fixed.

Sizemore career WAR: 28.2.
Tulowitzki: two 5+ WAR seasons in his first three.
A. Ramirez career WAR: 31.6.
Joe Mauer: three 5+ WAR seasons, 29.7 career.
Ichiro career WAR: 48.7.
Shields: three 4+ WAR seasons in his first four.
Papelbon: two 3+ WAR seasons in his first four, and he did it as a reliever.

A lot of the other guys on your list had one solid or good season and have never really been considered that good (W. Rodriguez, Lind, McLouth, etc).

don
Guest
don
6 years 1 month ago

Rollins averaged 5 WAR per season from 2004-2008. He’s pretty good.

Joe
Guest
Joe
6 years 1 month ago

By the way “Tom B.” I may be mistaken but it seems like you are a Yankees fan. You defend Joba, then include a list of the most overrated, yet have zero Yankees players, and four Red Sox players. If you are going to include Lackey and Beckett, then you better include Burnett on that list. But again, I might be wrong in practically assuming you “bleed pinstripes.”

RoyaleWithCheese
Member
RoyaleWithCheese
6 years 1 month ago

Excellent point. He did include one Yankee: Granderson. On a related note, it could be that he feels Granderson is overrated because he hasn’t lived up to expectations in his 250 PAs as a Yankee.

Tom B
Guest
Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

You can put burnett on that list, i have no problem with that. i really just stopped looking when i got to pitchers.

now that i’ve seen it up close, granderson’s swing is god awful. i notice that you only snipe the fact that i put redsox on the list, not that i was wrong.

The Typical Idiot Fan
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

Swisher boggles my mind, as I can’t really think of anybody over hyping him at all. Did the SABR crowd do a lot of drooling over Swisher? He’s certainly living up to this type of hype if he is. I don’t remember he, himself, saying anything that warrants a negative reaction. He didn’t get up on stage and interrupt Taylor Swift or anything, did he?

The rest I can see. Not from (necessarily) a performance point of view but certainly from a “guys just don’t like these guys” point of view. Drew appears to have given himself a few bullseyes what with the contract opting out of and such. Alex, too. Steroids + announcing new deal during World Series + Madonna = over hyped I guess. Matthews Jr flapped his gums about deserving starting time and… well reap what you sow. Joba’s over hype was a media shit storm, so I can see that.

But Swisher. That one just doesn’t make sense.

The Typical Idiot Fan
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

Whoa. That was not supposed to go here. Reply fail…

Jonathan
Guest
Jonathan
6 years 1 month ago

“i really just stopped looking when i got to pitchers.”

Yet you managed to throw three Sox pitchers on there? Consistency! I am genuinely shocked Youkilis and Pedroia didn’t make your list.

PL
Guest
PL
6 years 1 month ago

Pretty mind blowing Jeter didnt take the #1 spot. Poor defense, actually NOT a team player (didnt give up SS to let the superior defender in A-Rod play there), I mean dont get me wrong he’s a HOFer but he’s not in the top 50 players ever, and you know some moron NY writer is going to have him in the top 5 sometime after he retires.

Its crazy to think that stupid jump-throw he does like 3 times a year wins him gold gloves. THAT, my friends, is over-rated.

Tom B
Guest
Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

it’s crazy to think that all you know is that he does a jump throw.

scatterbrian
Guest
scatterbrian
6 years 1 month ago

Has there ever been another middle reliever who had his own set of Rules?

Tom B
Guest
Tom B
6 years 1 month ago

He didn’t have “rules” as a reliever.

Eric Cioe
Guest
Eric Cioe
6 years 1 month ago

Sure he did. He couldn’t pitch back to back days, for instance, and he needed an extra day of rest for every inning he pitched in a given appearance.

Dan Greer
Guest
Dan Greer
6 years 1 month ago

One inning, one day off.
Two innings, two days off.
Three innings, three days off.
Two days off before pitching 2 innings.

These are most certainly “Joba rules” in relief.

http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/yankees/item_ESh9bF9uuIJYO8PLKJhCVL;jsessionid=20401F90ACFE2260FFBE8E2E87FCFE60

Kevin S.
Member
Kevin S.
6 years 1 month ago

More rules might have saved some young pitchers from other noted arm-shredders, you know.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

no earthly idea what this adds to the conversation or how it is relevant

Steve
Guest
Steve
6 years 1 month ago

Yes, I am positive there are other young relievers that have “rules” for usage. The only difference is the NY media learning about them from Joe Torre.

The rules were simply designed to Torre-proof their young prospect.

The backlash is ridiculous.

jscape2000
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

Did Joe Torre ever meet a reliever whose career he couldn’t break (expect Rivera)?

Tom Zig
Guest
Tom Zig
6 years 1 month ago

Well it had more to do with the fact that:

a) Joe Torre was notorious for burning through relievers
b) Joba was starting all year and was near his innings limit for the year
c) Joba had never been a reliever before and the Yankees wanted to safeguard him

Eric Palmer
Guest
Eric Palmer
6 years 1 month ago

Neftali Feliz had the “Joba” rules last year as a rookie…

DT
Guest
DT
6 years 1 month ago

No Ryan Howard? Joe Mauer (compared to last year and his new contract at least)? hell even Torri Hunter, or the great Dice-WALK A LOT OF GUYS? Who did these people interview ?

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

definitely agree on torii hunter…

dice-walk isn’t on there cuz there’s nobody left that thinks he’s any good. you can’t be overrated if everybody already thinks little of you

neuter_your_dogma
Guest
neuter_your_dogma
6 years 1 month ago

A. Soriano?

waynetolleson
Guest
waynetolleson
6 years 1 month ago

You know what’s REALLY overrated? Stupid lists like this one.

Your Face
Guest
Your Face
6 years 1 month ago

Your face is overrated.

Bronnt
Member
Bronnt
6 years 1 month ago

Your Mom

/eighthgrade

Larry
Guest
Larry
6 years 1 month ago

J.D. Drew – yes, he is a talented player when healthy but at times it seems like he’d rather be somewhere other than a baseball field. He is a professional baseball player because someone told him he is very good at it and Scott Boras said he can make millions and millions of dollars playing the game.

Nick Swisher – bangs Joanna Garcia and thinks he is a superstar when he is merely a very good, sorta all-star caliber player. Swisher tends to find the camera more often than not.

Gary Matthews – he is a POS.

A-Rod – more flash than substance.

Joba – he is supposed to be the next Clemens, but hasn’t done squat because he has been jerked around.

Jason B
Guest
Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

A-rod – more flash than substance? Explain. Here’s my list for “substance” from Baseball-Reference.com:

Active leader in wins above replacement, 26th all-time
3rd in OPS+ (active), 43rd all-time
3rd in adj. batting runs (active), 22nd all-time
4th in win probability added (active), 22nd all-time
2nd in HR (active), 7th all-time
3rd in RBI (active), 20th all-time
3 MVP’s, 2 second-place finishes, 1 third.
13th on the HOF black ink test. 7th on the HOF monitor test. 8th on the HOF standards test. 5 most comparable players: Hank Aaron, Mel Ott, Jimmie Foxx, Frank Robinson, Mickey Mantle, all hal of famers.
.410 career wOBA, 152 wRC+, 106 wins above replacement (and counting)

Your turn for the “flash” list…ready, set, GO!!

Larry
Guest
Larry
6 years 1 month ago

More flash than substance –

I will not really argue A-Rod’s accomplishments [he finally won a ring, he’s been a superstar all these years even though he is an admitted PED user].

However people still have perceptions of him as this guy who is petty, all about himself and fake. Maybe those things don’t matter, but maybe the baggage of being A-Rod marginalizes his image as a truly great baseball player.

Derek
Guest
Derek
6 years 1 month ago

Being “merely very good” is quite the oxymoron.

Hizouse
Guest
Hizouse
6 years 1 month ago

Proper grammar in post titles is also apparently overrated.

Jacob
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

I’m really shocked that Drew is on this list like a lot of people are. I guess maybe it’s some hold over from players being shocked he got as big of a pay day as he did, but it’s pretty difficult to say he’s overrated at all because I know tons of Red Sox fans who even don’t like him and think he isn’t very good, despite his very good numbers for an outfielder.

The A Team
Guest
The A Team
6 years 1 month ago

Here’s a game, who’s on this list next year?

My nomination is Aroldis Chapman

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

2, 4, and 5 are all head scratchers… to be honest, i think all 3 are UNDERrated (yes, even arod)

quincy0191
Guest
quincy0191
6 years 1 month ago

A-Rod is overrated now, but looking at his career as a whole, you’re right, he probably is underrated. It’d be damned hard to overrate him from that perspective, much like Bonds or Ruth.

rbenchley
Guest
rbenchley
6 years 1 month ago

Nick Swisher is a pretty good player, but I heard he has a tendency to act like a jackass in the clubhouse. Ozzie couldn’t stand him and he pissed off a lot of his teamates, and thats why he was traded. As a Sox fan I wasn’t very pleased about the trade and I would much rather have Swisher on the team than Juan Pierre, and I don’t buy into any of that crap about “team chemistry”, but at the same time it does suck when you’re forced to work closely with a co-worker that you can’t stand, no matter how talented they might be.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

i thought ozzie was the one that was a jackass?

Matt
Guest
Matt
6 years 1 month ago

By jackass you mean someone with a short temper for people who mistreat his players, or make unfair calls?

Yeah, he’s a jackass then.

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

howard overrated? A career .950 OPS, .373 OBP, averaging roughly 48 HRs per year, overrated?

How is it that you people spend so much time following the game, yet know nothing about it? Some wildly volatile UZR score doesn’t like him? Yet Mauer is the “best”?

Is he averaging over 10 HRs per season yet, even with his one fluke year stealing signs to hit hmmmm, just over HALF of Howard AVERAGE HR output? Christ you people are stupid.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

i think most would agree howard has been a more productive hitter over his career than mauer has… though howards platoon splits are scary bad

but mauers value is that he does it from the catching positiong as opposed to the 1b position… thats really the crucial difference between the value of the 2 players

all that said, i dont think either is overrated… both are valuable players

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

He’s not even the best C in his DIVISION. Please stop sucking Mauer’s d1ck. He’s a good player. You people are forcing him into the “Jeter role”, scraping any possible reason to credit him.

I wouldn’t mind if you people weren’t such f-ing sheep.Every blog about baseball, I have to read how Howard is overrated, yet Mauer is this baseball god. He’s barely the best player on his TEAM.

Players like Howard change the landscape of the league. Pitchers structure their whole game plan around guys like Howard, NOT Mauer.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

ironically, most of the commenters on this site (other than me) go out of their way to DIScredit jeter

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

even if it means being irrational and illogical… i mean a guy in this comment thread said (in what im assuming wasnt sarcasm) nomars offense/hitting numbers were better all time than jeters

theres a LOT of dumb things said in the comments (not by the authors, i think they do a super job) but mauer being a more valuable player than howard certainly isnt one of them

Tom
Guest
Tom
6 years 1 month ago

@this guy

He’s not the best catcher in his division? Who is better? Pierzynski? Carlos Santana? Kendall? Avila? How could any of those four be better than Mauer?

Jason B
Guest
Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

Yes, please enlighten us on who the best catcher is in the division, with some sort of credible logic to back up your contention.

THAT JASON KENDALL IS BADASS DOOD!!1!

Greg
Guest
Greg
6 years 1 month ago

this guy, you are a dipshit. Stop talking.

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

Most of you are the same crowd talking up Bay’s UZR problems (ignoring theimpact of Fenway) and defended Eric Byrnes’ value. Most of you have no idea how any of these statistics you spew are calculated. Your biased “rationale” can only be supported by internet nerds who have never touched a baseball and are happy to regurgitate manifestations of your personal frustrations.

Troy Tulowitzki? Are you F-ing kidding me? You fail to acknowledge obviously inflated statistics, yet you profess to be able to extrapolate the notion that a player like Howard is overrated?

Why does baseball have to be the forum for stupid to have the confidence to express opinions? Can you people try soccer? Your intensely overrated, ego-maniacal master (Beane) has taken a liking to it. They just signed that Theirry guy. Go get em! Forget baseball.

Tom
Guest
Tom
6 years 1 month ago

Calm down.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

the jason bay defense comments are extremely confusing. not only do they have nothing to do with anything in the article or the comment thread (and therefore totally irrelevant to everything), but they neglect the fact that jason bay was a horrible outfielder in pittsburgh as well, which is where the majority of his career has been spent.

the “impact of fenway” represents 1.5 seasons of his god-awful UZR… and doesnt explain the 4.5 preceding seasons of shitty defense

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

Talking of shitty defense, Jeter ranks right up there with the worst of them.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

JK… all of my posts throughout this thread have been about jeters OFFENSE, so im not sure why youve brought up jeters defense over and over and over…. BUT, since i can tell you really wanna argue this, ill throw my hat in the ring

jeters uzr/150 is only -4.9. hanley ramirez (who keeps being brought up in comparison) has a -8.8 uzr/150… and i dont think a -4.9 uzr/150 is as historically bad as some ppl in this comment thread have made it seem. you guys make it out to be like he has a -25 and is an infield version of adam dunn

yet youve taken an argument about his offense and brought up his defense… then youve taken an argument about jason bay, and brought up jeters defense again… and again, when nobody was talking about it

for you to bring it up unprovoked in 2 different discussions, you would think it would be a LOT worse than -4.9

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

Slugger, when you talk about someone being overrated, you have to talk about a player’s entire game — not just select out his offense. Jeter is one of the most well-paid and most-hyped shortstops to ever play the game. In that context, his lousy defense strongly contributes to him being overrated.

Hanley is not as well paid and not as hyped as Jeter. Therefore, even though his defense is as lousy as Jeter’s, he is not overrated. And his superior offense (higher career wOBA) offsets his slightly worse UZR.

You don’t get to decide what gets argued here. If you want to ignore posts that say Jeter is a lousy defender (and hence overrated) that’s your choice. But don’t try to say defense isn’t relevant to how someone is rated.

Slugger27
Guest
Slugger27
6 years 1 month ago

JK… ok he has subpar defense. So because he has subpar defense he’s overrated?

He has 70 WAR. doesn’t that equal like around $300M in value? he hasn’t been paid $300M

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

1) “ok he has subpar defense. So because he has subpar defense he’s overrated?”

No, it’s because he has consistently lousy defense every year, plus is rarely the best hitter at his position every year (see wOBA below), but gets paid the most by far of any shortstop and gets by far the most hype of just about any player. That’s why he is overrated in the opinion of many.

Jeter’s wOBA rank among shortstops:

2010 – #7
2009 – #3
2008 – #7
2007 – #4
2006 – #1
2005 – #3

Only once over the last 5 years was he the leader in wOBA for shortstops.

2) “He has 70 WAR. doesn’t that equal like around $300M in value? he hasn’t been paid $300M”

LOL, where do you get that his 70 WAR over that long time span equals $300 million? Also, fangraphs’ dollar valuations are not a good measure of how someone should actually paid. Therefore they are not a good measure of whether someone is overrated or not. Further, if you do look at the dollar valuations that fangraphs has for Jeter (they are incomplete, but just look at the ones they do include) they actually say he was OVERPAID over the last 8 years. So fangraphs’ dollar valuations actually disprove your opinion.

quincy0191
Guest
quincy0191
6 years 1 month ago

Howard’s great for dingerz, but he also hits .260 and plays mediocre to bad defense. No one’s arguing that he’s not a great player, or a guy that no one would want (or even a guy that someone wouldn’t want). Every team would love to have Howard’s bat in their lineup. But the question is not whether someone is a great player, but whether they are overrated, and Howard most certainly is. He provides a ton of value with the long ball, and walks plenty, but doesn’t do anything else, and he’s going to be paid $25 million a year through his thirties. A-Rod got similar money for posting similar numbers at SS and 3B. Mauer’s going to get similar money starting next year for posting a better AVG, lower SLG, and good defense as a C. Albert Pujols is going to get paid $5M a year more for considerably more value at the same position. Ryan Howard is a great player, but the fact that he posts 140+ RBI seasons every year is why he’s getting paid so much, and that’s a stupid reason to give someone that much money; I’d be surprised if he’s worth an average of $15M per year over the life of his $25M/year extension, and when you’re getting paid $10M more than you’re worth, you’re overrated.

Joe
Guest
Joe
6 years 1 month ago

Maybe there are other things in baseball besides offense…Or maybe smaller ballparks allow more of that aforementioned “offense.”

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

Check the splits you moron. The only year where there is a significant disparity was last year, where he performed better ON THE ROAD!

You people are told what to think before you even look at the most basic data. F-ing sheep.

James
Guest
James
6 years 1 month ago

Need a paper bag to breath into?

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

No. Stupidity frustrates me. I can barely stand watching a game with the volume on. It’s a curse.

Joe
Guest
Joe
6 years 1 month ago

Regardless of if I was incorrect about the splits, Howard is still a 1B. And not a very good defender, either.

But I really can’t see the point of even talking you, as your personal attacks are rather, well, elementary.

dnc
Guest
dnc
6 years 1 month ago

“Stupidity frustrates me.”

Self loathing is no way to live.

Jason B
Guest
Jason B
6 years 1 month ago

Tales of Irony, Chapter I
——————–

“Stupidity frustrates me,” says the guy who says there is a better catcher in the AL Central than Mauer, presumably with a straight face.

EDogg1438
Guest
EDogg1438
6 years 1 month ago

I wonder how much of the Swisher backlash has to do with the book Moneyball? Billy Beane basically said Swisher was the best player in that draft bar none. This is completely out of Swisher’s control but the players might be holding it against him that he isn’t the megastar that Beane thought he would be. Obviously a good player, but obviously not a superstar.

Or maybe they think he was overrated and got extra opportunity because his dad was a major leaguer?

Greg
Guest
Greg
6 years 1 month ago

I’d buy that. And the fact he dates a playmate, plays for the Yankees, has a powerful social networking engine behind him. He’s a showboat and shamelessly manufactures attention for himself. It’s stuff that makes other players envious/resentful.

I also heard about this poll way before the all-star break, this didn’t come “on the heels” of his all-star election.

My Grate Friend, Peason
Guest
My Grate Friend, Peason
6 years 1 month ago

Man, the people on this thread are mad. All-Star breaks must not be healthy for the soul.

Fubba
Guest
Fubba
6 years 1 month ago

Actually, a lot of these comments on both sides have made good sense. PLEASE, though – let’s all try to settle on some consistent criteria. I realize the player poll didn’t do that, either, so the whole thing is probably a waste of time. But how can you argue for, or against a particular player when there’s no agreement on what the word “overrated” even means? Once, that’s done, the next question oughta be: overrated, by whom? Fans? Beat writers? Joe Morgan? I’m a Yankee fan, but can’t complain about Joba ranking high on most lists.

jross
Guest
jross
6 years 1 month ago

Matt Kemp (gold glove?)
Cano ( although he has had an amazing year) has been overrated up untill now .
Jacoby Ellsbury. his defense is over rated as well.

I won’t say Either is over rated but I hate how he is supposed to be so clutch because of all his walk-off wins. ( “you can’t put a stat on that!” ~ Joe Morgan)

I believe one game I was watching complemented how fast Jeter applied a tag and Joe Morgan once again said “you can’t put a stat on that!”, talking about his applying a tag quickness.

bonestock94
Guest
bonestock94
6 years 1 month ago

Cano? He had one bad year, one better than average year, and the rest were pretty damn good. Maybe the first year breakout talk was a bit much, but after that I’d say he’s been underrated.

TedWilson
Guest
TedWilson
6 years 1 month ago

Pretty weak analysis. I think you take the word “overrated” to literally in this analysis and that is why you are left scratching your head when you pull out all of your metrics….

The players seemed to choose annoying players more than “overrated” players. This could, (usually), mean the players are not, literally annoying, but annoying because of the amount of media attention or talk given to each player.

JD Drew has another element. How can you not mention the way he bailed on the Phillies? It was pretty much unprecedented at the time for a player to simply tell the team that drafted him, sorry, thanks but no thanks. JD Drew and Boras demanded $10million to sign.

Since that was such a unique request you would expect JD Drew would be an unprecedented player? Uhh, not so much. He is your typical MLB top 5 OF and every year in baseball history there have been 5 guys you could say that of. Drew maybe worth his current contract, but he is not special. That makes him overrated.

A Rod? A Rod might be the biggest bore in baseball. I think players know this about now and pretty much resent the negative light he has brought the game. Again, your silly advanced metrics don’t cover this stuff.

Swisher? I think the players are jealous he is enjoying himself that much. It makes it worse that Swish is merely a decent player. I think you can chalk this up to jealously.

G Matthews JR? Bingo. We all can agree, players, fans and stats geeks, overrated. There you go.

Your analysis Jack was done with a 10 foot pole up your but. Loosen up and relax a little.

Chris
Guest
Chris
6 years 1 month ago

This is pretty simple.

Drew is overrated because he’s “overpaid”. Same with GMjr. Drew also has no heart.

Swisher is overrated because he’s associated with Moneyball. Also he has a loud personality (i.e. too much heart).

A-Rod is overrated because he wears lip gloss. He had a heart but it was hollowed out and filled with money.

Joba is overrated because of his antics/his general douchebaggery. I see no issue with this one.

bakes
Guest
bakes
6 years 1 month ago

you would think nomar would have the balls to use his real name. Can you link somewhere that actually has a measure of heart?

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

I think the definition of “overrated” as it applies to this poll is a player who doesn’t play up to the level of their contract and/or hype. The hype is created by the player himself, the media or fans.

For the five players who came out on top, it’s easy to see where they fall under that definition:

Swisher, hype
GMJ, contract
Drew, contract
A-Rod, contract, hype
Joba, hype

3FingersBrown
Guest
6 years 1 month ago

I think you guys are missing something here: you’re asking players to vote on their peers. Don’t you think that personality has a lot to do with it? Sarge Jr. aside (I don’t know much about his off-field rep), these guys all have rubbed people the wrong way for one reason or another.

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

How did Jeter rub people the wrong way? He won top honors in a similar SI players poll in 2008.

Bill
Guest
Bill
6 years 1 month ago

Except Jeter wasn’t voted as an overrated player?

JK
Guest
JK
6 years 1 month ago

Yes he was. SI did the poll in 2008 and more players were polled than in this one and Jeter came out as the #1 most overrated player.

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

Much more hazardous delusions prevail than what you people think you know about baseball. Who am I to stop you from taking your placebos?

We all subscribe to one delusion or another.

Santoro
Guest
Santoro
6 years 1 month ago

lol youre an angry person

this guy
Guest
this guy
6 years 1 month ago

Why does “honesty = anger”?

jross
Guest
jross
6 years 1 month ago

You foaming?

Rob in CT
Guest
Rob in CT
6 years 1 month ago

Odd list, really. Joba I get – sure, there was a ton of hype about him and he hasn’t yet really put it together (and might never). He was terrific in relief in ’07 and excellent as a starter in ’08 until the “minor” shoulder injury in Texas. Since then he’s pretty much stunk, while still doing his fist pumping and screaming. If I was an opposing player who had a vote in this, yeah, I’d probably rub it in.

Drew: it’s well known that he is underrated by many fans – I guess players too. Jealousy over the contract? Overrating his reputation for fragility? Anyway, it’s unfair but unsurprising.

ARod – ironic, don’t you think, after the post-season he just had? Pretty funny, if you ask me. Sub-par so far this year, definitely. Oh, and he makes $30MM and will until the end of time or somesuch. Nah, no jealousy there! Also, nobody likes him. His personality is what it is. So I’m not at all surprised. But I am highly amused. He finally plays like a superstar on the biggest stage and then gets voted as overrated by his peers. That’s SO ARod.

Swisher: this is the one I simply don’t get. Swish? Seriously? He’s done just about nothing wrong since coming to NY (he didn’t hit in the playoffs, though, which might have been big had ARod not gone nuclear). He’s having an excellent year this season. The only thing I can think of is that this is a reaction to his All-Star selection, beating out Youk, who was more deserving. That or it’s sour graps from Chicago… I don’t know. I’m at a loss on this one.

And for those whining about Jeter – I’m pretty sure he won this (or was on the list) last year or the year before. Understandably so, given the way the media treats him (which is frustrating, when you’re a fan of his and want to simply appreciate what he actually is, instead of hearing about things he’s not). Maybe the “Jeter’s overrated!” thing has jumped the shark.

this guy
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this guy
6 years 1 month ago

He’s been so overrated, he’s underrated now. (not sarcasm)

Zack
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Zack
6 years 1 month ago

Well this got ugly fast.

Who cares what 150 or so players think. MLB players also voted Jason Varitek into the All Star game last year. So who they think is overrated or underrated doesn’t really matter. They just go off of reputation, RBIs, etc.

Joe
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Joe
6 years 1 month ago

And I doubt they sit back and study what correlates to what, like the analysts/experts do. OBP to runs scored for example. They have better things to do, like play baseball. And I don’t mean that as an insult to the people that work hard at sites like these, or to diss the players either. They just have far different priorities than a Dave Cameron or whoever.

this guy
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this guy
6 years 1 month ago

I think your point makes sense to a degree, but to say the opinions of the people who ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME isn’t interesting is absurd.

If this is not at least of interest to you, I’m not sure you should be counted on to analyze anything of any relevance.

Dakota
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Dakota
6 years 1 month ago

J.D. Drew is definitely overrated. He managed to land the Cardinals Adam Wainwright ;)

John
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John
6 years 1 month ago

This is a joke. the only thing you learn from this is the psychology of the players.
How do we all, in society, put down those who people like better than us because we feel we are not getting our due. If we can knock them down a notch–we feel it actually raises our standing…its pathetic and predictable.

To say Joba is over-rated is a direct result of his fist pumping. He not over-rated. In fact, no one in New York rates him high in their minds–he had one good season in the beginning—and he was not overrated then because he was the best in the game at that spot.

Arod? Come on. Tell me what guy with 600 homeruns can throw 90Mph? I would like to see bonds do what he can do at 3rd. So again…its just Yankee haters and not liking the guy.

Jeter was most over-rated before– so what does that tell you…5 championships and on pace to have more hits that Rose..in 3 years he’ll be the top 5 in Hits all time—so we learn that players are just like us all…petty and sinful.

this guy
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this guy
6 years 1 month ago

Well done.

RPS
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RPS
6 years 1 month ago

You know who’s overrated? The Yankees. They suck.

nick
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nick
6 years 1 month ago

the list is “five guys most disliked by the other players.”

that’s it, it’s that simple.
you expect these guys to do analysis, calculate WPA and factor in contracts?

these are the five guys who are most typically thought of by their peers as dicks.

pele
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pele
6 years 1 month ago

it boggles my mind that people who read the articles on this site still cant comprehend why joe mauer is much more valuable than ryan howard or actually think that troy tulo is OVERRATED????

lol, i guess if your calculator (or brain in this case) is broken than it doesn’t matter what numbers you punch in, the answer will always be wrong.

Mark
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Mark
6 years 1 month ago

How about treating this statistically, since it is fangraphs? The player most people (fans and players alike) THINK is having a year for the ages, but is really just humming along with a slightly-above-average season is… Ubaldo Jimenez. The casual fans and dinosaur writers think he has “won” 15 baseball games – whatever that means, I thought teams won and lost games – and that he has performed in a manner to limit the opposition to just over 2 ER per game.

Neither claim is even remotely defensible. Jimenez is terribly overrated this year.

Bad Bill
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Bad Bill
6 years 1 month ago

Uh, I would claim that a guy showing a WHIP of under 1.05 is having considerably more than a “slightly-above-average season,” particularly when he’s playing half of it at Planet Coors…

Bad Bill
Guest
Bad Bill
6 years 1 month ago

If this was the “overhyped” list rather than the “overrated” list, it would look almost perfect to me. (I’d move Torii Hunter on in place of Drew. He simply isn’t the defensive headline maker he was five years ago, and he still gets a lot of press. Ryan Howard would also be a candidate, because Philadelphia is no small hype center itself.) Since hype comes from the media, and the media have this obsession with all things New York and Boston, and the players do read the papers, for them to draw these conclusions isn’t unreasonable.

But “hype” isn’t the same thing as ratings. Joba gets vast amounts of play in the press, but few of the people writing about him “rate” him as a particularly effective reliever, just as one who COULD be effective if everything worked right — and that is probably not an unrealistic view. Nor do I hear anyone gushing over Matthews in the press, even though his name was showing up there with considerable frequency for a while.

To me the most interesting thing about this poll is that it seems to suggest that to players, the people who do the hyping are also the ones doing the rating. That’s a more interesting commentary on the players’ mindset than their answers themselves.

Patrick
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Patrick
6 years 1 month ago

being overrated doesn’t mean you’re bad. example: kobe bryant is the most overrated basketball player. I don’t think he’s bad; he just doesn’t belong anywhere near the discussion of greatest players all-time, let alone active players.

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