Retiring Wahoo

In addition to some spirited discussion in the comments thread, Wednesday’s post about Chief Wahoo brought about an email from the folks at the Cleveland Frowns blog thanking me for raising the issue. Given their singular devotion to Cleveland sports, the Cleveland Frowns guys have spent a lot more time thinking about this than I have and, not surprisingly, have a much more thoughtful take on the subject. From their signature post on Wahoo last summer, some words worth remembering:

Those who want to bury Wahoo have to acknowledge why he has lasted so long — that in doing so they would be burying more than a racist caricature; they would be burying a part of our childhood and our culture. They must acknowledge that our collective attachment to Wahoo has little to nothing to do with an intent to disparage a race of people. So much of the resistance to attempts to get rid of Wahoo is a natural reaction by Tribe fans who feel that those who protest Wahoo are accusing them of racism, and telling them that there is something fundamentally wrong with those magical trips to the ballgame. This would offend anyone’s sense of justice. These activists must acknowledge the innocent aspects of our attachment to Wahoo before their appeals to his harmful effect will ever be well-received.

Once Tribe fans believe that our love for Wahoo is understood, we will be more apt to ask ourselves why we would want to be attached any longer to a symbol as potentially demeaning to a race of people as Wahoo is.

The Frowns’ have couched their anti-Wahoo campaign in a curse they believe his visiage has brought down upon Cleveland sports. I don’t believe in curses (or Buddha, Manta, Gita, Yoga, kings, Elvis, Zimmerman or Beatles) but one need not believe in them in order to want to relegate Chief Wahoo to the dustbin of history. Likewise, one need not demonize as racist the Indians’ fans who grew up with Wahoo and take issue with folks who think like I do on the subject.

Either way, I highly recommend that you read the Cleveland Frowns’ post because it is devoid of the kneejerk p.c. sentiment so many people accuse the anti-Wahoo camp of harboring. And if their arguments convince you, sign their petition to retire Chief Wahoo.


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Sara K
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Sara K

Great follow-up, Craig, and an important point made. Long-held associations surely must be hard to let go, especially since we essentially root for whoever happens to be wearing the laundry. The great Cleveland area fans deserve to enjoy their team without hint of shame.

(click!)

Sabertooth
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Sabertooth

Bah!  I’m Irish and the Notre Dame mascot is far more defamatory than is Chief Wahoo, but it’s fun and this is sports for Pete’s sake.  People need to get a life, or realize how good their lives must be that they have the time and energy and wherewithal to worry about cartoon mascots of sports teams.

Jacob Rothberg
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Jacob Rothberg

But isn’t this the entire problem? In 2009, the “we’re not racist we’re just ignorant fun lovin’ sports fans” argument just doesn’t hold water anymore. There should be no room for this kind of thing, and anybody who tries to condone it through the lens of nostalgia is complicit in furthering this demeaning garbage. There should be no wiggle-room for any kind of support or understanding of ‘Chief Wahoo’, the people of Cleveland do not need their feelings taken care of, they just need to stop supporting racism. Immediately.

Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra
Jacob—if you read the whole post you’ll realize that neither the Frowns’ nor I am condoning it.  We’re simply acknowledging that there are many people who are Indians fans who either don’t think about the racist implications of Wahoo or who may acknowledge it as falling into some “historical exceptions” clause and therefore less offensive somehow. Whether such a position is an intellectually valid one or not is irrelevant.  These are the people—good fans who support the team—that the Indians have to consider when making changes. The response is a simple one: acknowledge that your opponents in this (and any)… Read more »
Aarcraft
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Aarcraft

Sabertooth: Isn’t the Fighting Irish mascot a leprachaun? Thats a bit different than a cartoon caricature of an actual ethnic group. It might be demeaning to leprachauns, but I don’t hear them complaining.

Jacob Rothberg
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Jacob Rothberg

Craig – what i am saying is, there should be no debate. The “good people” you reference are casual racists, whether they like it or not,  and the fact that their feelings need to be acknowledged and assuaged only goes to show how far American society has yet to go before the evils of racism are purged. They are not monsters, they are just wrong, and engaging them in discussion will only serve to lengthen the amount of time that this degrading image can continue to be paraded across America’s televisions.

kranky kritter
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kranky kritter
Craig, Very well put. I would really like to see wahoo retired in a positive way. IMo it’s a far more positive resolution if current fans are allowed to be included as good guys in a collective decision. Symbols are quite capable of having different meanings to different people, and no harm is done to anyone’s PoV by noticing this. For example, the swastika used to have other positive meanings, and then it got co-opted by an ambitious graphic designer and ruined by a bunch of heinous a-holes. It’s ruined forever. Just the way it is. I experienced a similar… Read more »
Jacob Rothberg
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Jacob Rothberg

Sabertooth – tell me when the American Government and people carried out a concerted effort towards a genocide of the Irish, and then your comparison will hold water.

Jacob Rothberg
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Jacob Rothberg

Look – I’m sorry for the language here, and don’t print this if you disagree, but this is something i feel strongly about – If they were called the Cleveland Negroes and their mascot was a grinning minstrel or if they were called the Cleveland Jews and their mascot was a long-nosed banker, there would be no debate. This is the same, its just that Native Americans have been so marginalized that people feel like this kind of casual degradation is acceptable, when it definitely isn’t.

kranky kritter
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kranky kritter
I think it can be pretty tedious when folks insist that an analogy must provide exact symmetry in order to “hold water.” Certainly the behavior of the early American gov’t towards America’s natives was ugly and heinous and shameful. But this does not mean that the modern standard for being offended by stereotypes must include a component of genocide. That’s just silly. I’ve thought that the Wahoo symbol is ugly and embarassing to Indians fans for some time, and that it ought to go. But I still stand comfortably with all the folks who think we might be better-served if… Read more »
Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra
Jacob—I think we’re misunderstanding each other. No one is suggesting that there’s a debate about the ultimate appropriateness of Wahoo. We’re talking about the practicalities of relegating him to history.  I want that to happen as efficiently and quickly as possible.  History suggests that simply asserting the wrongness of one’s opponents and the righteousness of one’s own cause protracts, rather than contracts, that process.  I have no intention to ever entertain the idea that Wahoo is not offensive and would not do so if I ran the Indians.  At the same time, however, acknowledging that many people who want to… Read more »
Aarcraft
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Aarcraft
kranky kritter
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kranky kritter
Jacob, I don’t think it’s acceptable either. And I think that its clear that the folks Craig is highlighting don’t think so either. To me, the salient question is how to bring about the change that we’d like to see. Obviously you have very strong feelings about this, and I respect that. In fact I share them to a substantial extent. The question you need to ask yourself is this. If the desirable change you want can be brought about, is it essential for it to come about in a way that you get to experience feelings of self-righteous vindication… Read more »
Rob
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Rob

“The ‘good people’ you reference are casual racists”

This is exactly the kind of rhetoric that does nothing to move the discussion forward.  We all have to understand that these symbols have different meanings to different people and any argument that boils down to, “You’re racist because I say you are”  is a nonstarter.

The bottom line is that many people view Chief Wahoo as nothing more than a stupid logo, one that carries more association to a baseball team than to the Native Americans that it ostensibly represents.

tadthebad
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tadthebad
While I support removing Chief Wahoo as the Indians mascot, it also strikes me that as long as we as individuals or a whole are focused or obsessed with finding evidence of racism, we will find it.  As far as the Irish go, without going as far genocide, they have certainly experienced racism and efforts to minimilize their existence.  Perhaps not by the US Gov, although I’m sure someone could make a case for it.  Interestingly enough, the Irish (full disclosure: my heritage) are one of the only cultures/nationalities for which it remains generally acceptable to make fun…usually with references… Read more »
Bernie
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Bernie

It is a freakin’ CARTOON!  I’m a white guy and look nothing like Homer Simpson and as a child I looked nothing like Charlie Brown.  I see no outrage and call to remove those CARTOONS from the stage.  Why can’t people understand that it’s CARTOON.  What about Fat Albert?  The Family Guy?  King of the Hill?  Like Wahoo, they’re all CARTOONS.

Sean
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Sean

I hope you meant it, because that Ferris Bueller scene-drop just made my day:

A person should not believe in an “-ism,” he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon, “I don’t believe in Beatles, I just believe in me.”

Heath
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Heath
I think I fall on Jacob’s side of the argument on this one, I don’t think that the Cleveland fans are racist, casual or otherwise but that doesn’t make that caricature any more appealing. I am a Washington Redskins fan so I am intimately familiar with this debate. I won’t stop supporting my team due to a mascot because, in my mind, it is ultimately “only a mascot”. However as soon as you ascribe emotinal feelings on the mascot (“a part of our childhood and our culture”), you have lost the argument. I have stated to fellow Redskin fans that… Read more »
Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra

Sean—that was really a John Lennon drop, from his song “God.”  In the movie, Bueller was quoting the song.

Chris H.
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Chris H.
I agree with Rob and (it seems) most of the other comments here that by demonizing the supporters, you end up with a “non-starter.”  That’s true in most situations, I expect. The image is, of course, racist.  It’s also the symbol of a team.  It’s many things, and if we ignore that, we’ll never get it changed. Jacob: I understand completely where you are coming from.  This is an issue of practicality/expediency.  Yes, if it were the Cleveland Negroes with a minstrel logo, we wouldn’t be having this debate.  Yes, you are correct that Native Americans have been marginalized to… Read more »
Chris H.
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Chris H.

Bernie: are you seriously saying you can’t understand the difference between a cartoon like The Simpsons and a racist caricature?  Really?

bernie
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bernie

Please, enlighten me.  Precisely what is the difference between Homer Simpson, Fat Albert and Chief Wahoo?  What, exactly makes Wahoo “racist” and other two not?

Bill Sperounis
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Bill Sperounis
The Native American issue is more complex than most today want to admit.  It is definitely a blight on the historical record.  However, if you really get into the history, what transpired was the result of actions by both sides.  The problem is that the early attempts at more peaceful solutions were undermined by representatives from both sides creating a distrust that could not be overcome.  I get where Jacob is coming from but getting rid of a mascot is not going to change any of that.  Maybe it might give a few a more warm fuzzy feeling but I… Read more »
kranky kritter
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kranky kritter

Bernie, I just can’t credit your hypothesis, which is apparently that a cartoon cannot be offensive or racist. It simply makes no sense whatsoever to me.

bernie
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bernie

My hypothesis is not that a cartoon “can’t” be racist.  I totally agree it can be.  My question is why are two cartoons, which are obviously exaggerated caricatures, not seen as racist when the other is?  They’re all three in the same mode, yet only one is viewed as racist.  I’m just trying to understand the criteria.

fifth of
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fifth of
It is interesting that a lawyer is pushing the argument that you can’t convince people to change their ways without first acknowledging their innocence. It is interesting that, as far as I can tell, the lawyer is more or less embracing Derrick Bell’s interest-convergence theory as an historical inevitability. It is interesting in general that white fellow travelers tend to view their role as convincing activists of color to change their methods in order to make them communicable to white communities, when one might otherwise see the responsibility of white subjects as being to ensure that the ACTUAL critique is… Read more »
kranky kritter
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kranky kritter
Bernie, since Chief Wahoo is the mascot of the INDIANS, it’s should be pretty clear to everyone that Wahoo was explicitly designed to be symbolic of Indians as a group. In my opinion, that gives all people in the group INDIANS (or sympathetic to the group INDIANS) some right to object to the depiction. They get to say what they sincerely find troubling, and if we have some empathy and think they make a valid point, we support them. That’s how decent people behave, I think. Homer Simpson is symbolic only of HOMER SIMPSON. That gives all people in the… Read more »
bernie
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bernie

So, if I can simplify your response, I guess your view is that anything can be called racist if it makes someone feel bad.  In other words, if I personally am offended by something, that automatically makes it racist.

Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra
Fifth:  At the outset, I will not accept your premise that declining to rub a person’s face in their guilt is akin to proclaiming their innocence. None of us are innocent about much of anything in this world, friend, and I will not have you put that word in my mouth with respect to this subject.  With that out of the way: If, as you say, “The debates about Chief Wahoo are, absolutely, not central in the least to the struggles that they’ve emerged from,” then why is it necessary to apply your more rigorous standards of racial justice to… Read more »
Ron
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Ron
I’m going to go ahead and add my opinion, and get ready to write, guys, becasue you’re going have a field day calling me names and insulting me. 1. Does anything thing that originally Wahoo was designed to be intentionally racist and demeaning? Because it wasn’t. It was a LOGO/PICUTRE/DRAWING/CARTOON, whatever? Sure, it’s past its time, and probably needs to go. So waht. 2. Craig, I’ll send you a check for $100. Lets get a drive going to raise enough money to give to Winter Haven so they can paint over a LOGO/PICUTRE/DRAWING/CARTOON. 3. Let’s all pat ourselves on the… Read more »
Sara K
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Sara K
Bernie, As I posted yesterday in the “Whitewashing Wahoo” thread – there is a different set of rules for the way a culture refers to itself and the way it refers to another culture. I am assuming (do correct me if I’m wrong) that Native Americans are not responsible for the creation of or the continuation of Chief Wahoo.  There is also a different set of rules for the way we refer to groups who are percieved to have more power.  For example, it is ok for the poor to mock the middle-class and the rich.  It is ok for… Read more »
Sara K
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Sara K

Ron,

I get the feeling that you consider a “LOGO/PICUTRE/DRAWING/CARTOON” as not being worth the effort. The problem is that not enough people have sufficient cultural contact with Native American groups to have any idea what their past and present culture is like.  All most people have are representations of Native Americans in the media, which includes “LOGOs/PICUTREs/DRAWINGs/and CARTOONs.” Does changing Chief Wahoo solve their very real, very challenging economic and social issues?  Of course not.  But given their very real, very challenging economic and social issues, isn’t it Chief Wahoo an image in extremely bad taste?

bernie
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bernie

Sara K, I figured that was the rationale.  It’s the old “OK to hammer the white guys but don’t touch anyone else.”  Got it.  Given that, I don’t have anything more to say on the issue because there’s no way any amount of rational or logical argument can counter that kind of “reasoning.”

Sara K
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Sara K

I understand that race is a particularly touchy subject, but facts is facts.

Who is it that is “hammering the white guys”?

Ron
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Ron
Sara, I understand your point, and as you know, I’ve spent lots of time in South Dakota, out and about and on the reservations. I know what it’s like out there, and it’s ugly. But people want to cherry pick their moral outrage, and only want to do what’s necessary to get noticed. If the people complaining about Wahoo put as much effort into raising money to build another rehab center, the Indian community would be much better off than if a logo is painted over. Especially since 95% of Indians could care less about Wahoo. But since the majority… Read more »
Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra
Ron—not to step on Sara’s toes here, but my response to that is that this is a baseball blog.  One that, fortunately for me and thanks to the eyes and contributions of all of you, gets some modicum of attention from the sporting press and baseball front offices from time to time.  I don’t expect that getting rid of Wahoo is going to make any one Indian’s life better, but (a) it’s a positive thing in its own right; and (b) it’s within the realm of the possible for me that many other things aren’t. Campus activists and armchair radicals… Read more »
Sara K
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Sara K

Ron,

I think you just said a lot more than you did in your previous post. And you are absolutely right.  The average person hasn’t a clue the kind of abject poverty many NA groups experience.  It’s truly shocking. And it’s a shame that most Americans know more about professional sports mascots than the actual people who live in the country, but don’t they?

Sara K
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Sara K

Craig – this is a baseball blog?

Ron
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Ron

I guess I just have too much time on my hands.

Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra

Sara—hard to tell sometimes, isn’t it?  Don’t worry: come April 5th there will be no mistaking it.

Rob
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Rob
@Ron – I can’t really think of a better way to help educate the masses to the plight of Native Americans than for the Cleveland Indians Baseball Club to step up and make a public statement regarding their mascot, their logo, and its history by announcing plans to get rid of it and the ridiculous story of its origin.  Ideally, with some monetary action to back it up.  (It sure would be nice for some of these organizations that use Native Americans as mascots to contribute some of the teams’ wealth to their plight.) @Craig – Effect, when used as… Read more »
kranky kritter
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kranky kritter
Bernie, simplify my argument into something I didn’t say if that pleases you. Good luck with such practices over the remainder of your life. Hopefully you shall earn and keep many friends this way. It’s utterly unclear to me what you’re trying to achieve here beyond winning an argument. I apologize for engaging with you in what I had hoped could be a good faith discussion. Far too many folks haunt blogs trying to win arguments, and far too few make any effort to better understand the viewpoints of other folks or, shudder, learn something.Or acknowledge when someone else makes… Read more »
Jacob Rothberg
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Jacob Rothberg

hey all – proud to have started a bit of a fire on this issue, the core of my argument is thus: these kinds of images are, and should be, offensive to all rational people. Discussion can be had and “traditionalist” fans can be succored, but only after these things are removed. There does not need to be a value statement, or debate, attached to their removal, other than that no racial group deserves this kind of public marginalization and stereotyping. In this circumstance I believe it is fully justified to shoot first and ask questions later.

fifth of
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fifth of
Craig, where is my advocacy or rubbing people’s noses in guilt? My previous post critiqued the notion that people should be ensnared in other people’s definitions of innocence or guilt. It is a raging double standard that a culture hell-bent on assigning guilt to the people at its margins demands to have its innocence stroked Chief Wahoo should inspire people not to redefine themselves in terms of the BS binaries their culture has created of innocent/guilty, racist/non-racist, and so forth. I don’t want to rub people’s noses in the guilt of their white ancestors, nor do I consider it guilt… Read more »
Ron
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Ron

Wow, there’s a quote from ‘Blazin’ Saddles’ that comes to mind, and since I’m from Kansas City, I know well.

Unfortuantely, it would never pass the censor.

Sara K
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Sara K
One worthwhile (I think) observation about the cartoon portion of the debate is that while we have caricatures of white people, such as Homer Simpson, we also have *thousands* of other representations of white people, most of which are fairly accurate depictions of white people as they live, work, and recreate. Almost the *only* widely-viewed representations we have of Native Americans are sports mascots, which most often represent a cultural image of the Indian as a feather-wearing, face-painted warrior, which is not an accurate representation of how actual Native Americans live their lives. Another random rhetorical cul-de-sac in this discussion… Read more »
Ron
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Ron

Wait, delete the Kansas City reference. Wrong one.

But the first quote still applies.

Chris H.
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Chris H.
Jacob: and if one of us here had the power to eradicate Chief Wahoo by fiat, I’m sure we’d do that. Since we don’t, it behooves us to build popular support for the idea.  Do I wish the Indians would just do it?  Yep.  But since they haven’t, what other choice do I have? Ron: it sounds like you’re saying that because (A) the drawing may not have been “intentionally” racist and (B) it doesn’t solve all of the greater ills of Native Americans that we should abandon this altogether. First, whether it was “intentionally” racist…what does that even mean? … Read more »
Vinnie
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Vinnie

Based on my experience at Marquette—where we tried to revive the Warriors nickname, 100% sans Native American context three years ago—anything caricaturizing Native Americans isn’t very long for this world. Then again, branding issues for a pro team with more money and clout make for a lot more inertia. So maybe I’m wrong.

Adam
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Adam

Has anyone mentioned that the Indians organization has effectively (and quietly) whitewashed the logo from their organization?

You will not go into Progressive field and see any evidence of Wahoo on anything other than merchandise sold in a team shop. You will not go into their new park in Goodyear and see it in any signage. You will never see it on any memo or any webpage.

It merely exists in the realm of merchandise that still remains extremely popular among their fans.

Sara K
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Sara K

Adam – that’d be a start, though I just went to their MLB site and while he’s not a headliner, he’s plenty there.

Aaron Moreno
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Aaron Moreno

I won’t lie, I haven’t read any of this, and as an ethnic minority myself, I don’t have to. That said:

“tell me when the American Government and people carried out a concerted effort towards a genocide of the Irish, and then your comparison will hold water. “

You obviously haven’t been watching Notre Dame football.

Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra

He’s on the caps, which are visible on every play of every broadcast.  Well, except when they wear those alternates they introduced last year which are SWEEEEEEEEET.

Chris H.
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Chris H.

Aaron: piffle.  The American Government hasn’t done anything to Notre Dame.

Notre Dame has done it all by itself.

Adam
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Adam

Sara: Big oops there on my website comment.

Also, I don’t think Wahoo has been the featured logo on any Indians uniform for quite some time. He might be on the sleeve on a few of the alternates from 2003-2004.

The Cursive I and block C are the mainstays. Although no one really likes the cursive I.

Craig Calcaterra
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Craig Calcaterra

Adam:  Wahoo has been the primary logo on the caps for at least 15 years:

http://exhibits.baseballhalloffame.org/dressed_to_the_nines/uniforms.asp?league=AL&city=Cleveland&lowYear=1993&highYear=2008&sort=year&increment=18

The I and C are both alternates.

RoyceTheBaseballHack
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RoyceTheBaseballHack

Wow! I just want to weigh in and share that this really has been a great debate.  I plan to re-read it over the weekend.

mando3b
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mando3b
Does anybody else remember a NY Times article I’m sure I read sometime in the late ‘80s or early ‘90s in which the writer professed amazement at stopping for gas on an Indian reservation and seeing many of the locals in Wahoo caps? His (her?) take was that they viewed the symbol as somehow “theirs”; the writer made no generalizations about its overall acceptability, and the reader definitely got the feeling that this was something of an inside joke. I know I haven’t made this up—Wahoo irritates me as much as he does any of you. BTW, could those “I”… Read more »
Hizouse
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Hizouse

fifth of:  just fyi, Derrick Bell has been completely discredited since Operation Shutdown.

fifth of
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fifth of

Hizouse – just because you quit your tenured Harvard Law post in protest doesn’t mean you are discredited! wink

Hizouse
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Hizouse

I disagree.  Without passing judgment on whether the establishment’s actions were demeaning in truth, he essentially took millions for doing nothing, and he has been irrelevant ever since.

C-Town Fan
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C-Town Fan

Jacob Rothberg sure is full of himself, among other things. How he gets from “wherewithal to worry about cartoon mascots” to “we’re not racist we’re just ignorant fun lovin’ sports fans” is unbelievable. Rothberg is probably the same guy driving the Lexus because those “Japs” make good cars then auto locks the doors when an African American couple pull along side of his car at a stop light. Anyone who spouts holier than thou surely isn’t.

Jim
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Jim

My Grandmother is Native American,I have a dream catcher,and a medicine man tatooed on my arm. I am a cleveland fan, so i also have a tatoo of Chief Wahoo. Am i a racist,I THINK NOT. Racism would die in this country if it was not shoved in our faces every day by people who wont just let go of the past

Sara K
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Sara K
Jim – I think most of the conversation has been about how using the term “racism” is a big part of the problem.  That’s why the Cleveland Frowns guys are doing what they can to put the issue in other terms.  No one is saying that Cleveland fans are racist.  The willingness to “let go of the past” is at the very heart of the issue.  If we should be willing to let go of the past, then why not change the logo, which is an outdated remnant of the past?  Why does it *have* to be a reference to… Read more »
hans
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hans
I randomly decided to listen to that Lennon album today, Its pretty solid all the way through, and that song “god” that Craig mentions is great and challenging. There was a discussion about this topic over at LetsGoTribe.com that I’ll link here: http://www.letsgotribe.com/2008/4/9/391105/return-of-the-cleveland-bl This is one of the better discussions I’ve seen on here (or any other site) and to tell you the truth as an Clevaland Indians fan, I see valid points being made from multiple sides, which both intrigues and and excites me. I’m not sure where I fall in this debate, and I’m also not sure my… Read more »
walter c moreland
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walter c moreland

leave the indians alone,the ones who are complaining have an idenity crisis,they would cry even if the team were called the lans stand or the calvery, or the cleveland abolistionist

Real American
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Real American
Why don’t we just eliminate all images of American Indians from our entire society and forget they even exist. Wouldn’t that just solve this problem? While we’re at it. Let’s change the names of our landmarks and cities and states that bear American Indian names. That way, no one would be offended anymore. Or why don’t we just make Chief Wahoo a white guy. In all seriousness, I fail to see the problem here. The American Indians who are complaining about Wahoo, as well as the guilty whites, see Wahoo and automatically think negative thoughts about American Indians, or so… Read more »
Sara K
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Sara K

RA –

I don’t think that people who see Chief Wahoo necessarily have “negative” thoughts about Native Americans. But a few questions come to mind…

Is Chief Wahoo meant to represent “Indians” in some respect?  If so, what ideas/values does he communicate?

Cleveland Frowns
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Cleveland Frowns
Thanks for the post, Shyster.  Some good comments here.  But to Real American directly above, and to those who think that the Fighting Irish or Minnesota Vikings logos are remotely comparable, consider that those were logos of white people made by white people.  Real American, Wahoo does deprive someone of rights.  It deprives a race of people of the right to not have a Major League Baseball team emblazoned with a logo intended to cast that race as anachronistic savages.  The symbolism is huge here.  Like some folks have argued above, if the logo were a black ‘sambo’ caricature, or… Read more »
oldpaddy
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oldpaddy

I was called a racist about 10 years ago because I’m a Red Sox fan and once upon a time the Sox were run by racists.
Personaly I see no problem with chief wahoo or drunk irish midgets. Devil mascots (Jews) on the other hand…

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